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Messages - gaigaia

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Dungeon World / Damage rules using 2d6 rolls
« on: November 21, 2012, 03:20:16 PM »
So, what's the intention behind this idea? To use a single type of roll to all kinds of tests in the game was one of the mains reasons. But the other one is the idea behind the 2d6 roll, where a 6- is a miss, a 7 to 9 a weak and a 10+ a strong hit: the idea of the roll creating fiction.

The coldness of the Damage x Hit Points system was always awry to me. This is an idea and that has worked pretty well in my group, although with some problems. Maybe you guys can help, ey?

So, here is it:

When you cause damage to someone, roll+ Damage of your weapon. If 6-, you weapon didn't cause significant damage. On a 7 to 9, it scratches, stuns or back off the enemy. On a 10+, it mangles, mutilates, kills or cause grievous damage.

Notes on the move: The Damage is the value of the weapon (-1 for fists, 0 for improvised weapons such as chairs, +1 for small weapons, +2 for medium and +3 for big weapons). You could argue that 'When I attack a full plate knight and a stray dog, the damage roll is the same?'.

Yes. It might seem strange, the same way that it must have felt strange when you played Apocalypse World for the first time and realised that, when you attack a master fighter or a sick beggar, you roll the same Go Aggro+Hard. The game is about narrative.

The damage roll, like any other roll, is only made when there is risk. If your sword WILL hurt the armourless man when it hits him, then you don't need to roll. Accept a 10+ automactically. The same thing, if you are fighting a titanium dragon, you won't hurt him. Use the fiction to make this decisions, not the rolls.

Then, the roll for Protection:

When you are hurt, roll + Protection (the value of the armour). 6-, you are seriously hurt. 7 to 9, you are stunned, pushed back or wounded. On a 10+, you are fine.

Again, so a goblin with his bare hands will have the same 'damage' of a giant with a battle axe? No, but the Protection move is the same. Just use the fiction and common sense, and there will be no problem.

But, what about HP? We use a system similar to the Monsterhearts hack, using conditions. So, if you roll a 8 in your protection roll and you strain a muscle, or hurt your leg, or get nauseated from a blow, you just receive that condition, like 'stunned', 'nauseated', 'sick', 'pushed back', 'afraid'. If you get a more serious damage (6- in protection), the same thing: 'broken ribs', 'smashed arm', 'gaping stomach wound'.

The thing with healing is that it 'erases' a condition. If it is a minor healing spell or potion, it erases a minor wound (nauseated, stunned, scratched etc). If the wound is major, it needs a major healing spell or item. So, how do you die? If you receive a grievous wound and cannot heal, you die. Simple as that. Your arm was mutilated by a Gorgon and you have no healling scroll, cleric or whatev's? You dead.

One thing that might be asked is: 'Would rolling for defense make the game slower?'. The answer, at least from my table's experience, is no. It's kind of strange, but changing the concept of damage and HP to a more narritive oriented mechanic, the rolls became very, very fluid.  The flow of a 'simple attack' woud be as follows:

1. Player say his intention with the attack and make the move
2.  If the player hurt the monster, he rolls for damage and the MC narrates the consequences.
3.  If the monster also hurt the player, the player now rolls his protection. The MC narrates the consequences.

This is very direct:
MC: A giant vulture man descends upon your back, pinning you to the ground. What do you do?
Warrior: I thrust my swrod into the monster (rolls for Hack and Slash, gets 8)
MC: Your strike hit right in it's leg. Roll the damage (warrior rolls 2d6+2 from his long sword, getting 11). You swing your sword and cleaves through the creature's leg, with it's thick, black blood splashing in your chest. While you were swiging, the monster pecked you violently. Roll protection (warrior rolls 2d6+1 from his leather armour and get 8). The pecking hurts your arm (now, in the fiction, the warrior is with his arm hurt)

So, that's the idea behind it: Make damage rolling just as the other rolls of the game, a mechanic into fiction without abstract concepts of HP. Just roll and get conditions, simple as that.

What do you think? It seems to work in my tables, with a few of hiccups with healing. What do you think that could be done to improve it? Or why do you hate it?

I would like to hear your opinions,


Dungeon World / Re: How long do your fights usually take?
« on: November 21, 2012, 02:43:55 PM »
All fights can last as long or as little as the MC and the groups desires. You can say, for example, that the warrior, on a 7 to 9, kills and guts the Troll, while being hurt too. A move is not a single 'action', but IT CAN BE.

You can make a roll to signify a whole war. Normally, my fights are not not determined by the 'kind' of enemy. So, if they are fighting one thousand Stygs sucking their blood, or a giant purple wurm, it's the same thing. What I diferentiate is:

a) How central is the fight to the plot? If the objective is go to a village and discover more things about a magical artifact and they fight in a random encounter with Worgs, why would that encounter last more than even 10 minutes? Unless the fight has a reason, it will last 5 minutes or less.

b) If the fight is the main event (the final boss or something), normally it can take 30 minutes or more. One time, they were fighting a draconian knight. The last adventure they dwelved into his fortress and finished getting to him. He was waiting them, at his throne, and grimacing menacingly. The next session, boom, they fought him for more than one hour. It was a mix between Dragon Ball and the covers of Heavy Metal.

So, how important is the fight? That's how much it should take to be handled.

Dungeon World / Re: AW report, fights too long, and a miserable player
« on: November 21, 2012, 02:29:41 PM »
I wasn't in the session, so I really can't give a true oppinion about it. A 90 minutes battle in my rpg table would be a whole friggin war.

Last session, the ranger of my group went into the city of the undead and was hidding in a pile of debri, when a giant, bile rotten vulture man step by her hideout entrance. The bird puched her trough the debris and she rolled to the streets, and the rest of the group found her.

The warrior screamed and taunted the vulture man (Defy Danger +Charisma), 10+, and the vulture ignored the ranger and went to the warrior. He tried to run (defy danger +DEx, 6-) and the vulture stomped him into the ground. The paladin tried to fight the beast (hack and slash, 7 to 9) and, although he hurt it, the vulture pushed him away. The warrior, still under the beasts claws, used his sword to try to impale the monster (10+), and he cut it's leg off. The rogue, who was sneaking behind, tried stabing the monster (Hack and slash with Dex, 7 to 9) and the monster went flying, so I said 'if you want to attack it, you will have to grab it', and so does he.

While grabbing the vulture's back, a mob of undead rushes the players. The Thief degolates the vulture and saves against the fall (defy danger DEX, 10+), while the others are hacking through the zombies. They go trough the houses of the decadent slums, breaking through the cheap wood walls and, from the mountains of debris, scrap and trash, hands and hacked body pieces try to push them back.

They transverse it all and the building collapses, while they run away from the town.

All of it took 40 minutes, and mixed suspense (the ranger trying to hide from the monsters), Boss fight (the vulture man), Mob fight (the zombies) and chase (throught the slums).

What I always do is to consider 7 to 9 a omen, and not a bad thing. It's a future bad thing to happen if you do not do something.

I really can't imagine a fight being 90 minutes long like DeD 4th, which is the paralell to video games of 'Button mashing', while DeD is 'dice rolling'.

Dungeon World / Dark Souls Hack: Bestiary
« on: November 08, 2012, 07:48:26 AM »
Here is the ongoing bestiary that I'm writting for the Dark souls hack. I also talk about the possibility of adapting the smart style fighting of Dark Souls.

I would like feedback.

Peace and Praise the Sun

Dungeon World / Re: Dark Souls hack
« on: November 07, 2012, 06:33:42 PM »
So, I see 2 options about the resurrection feature:

1) You slowly revive at the spot. This way, the old Karma mechanic can kick in. You can use Karma to heal after you 'die'. Or maybe you can pay 1 Karma to 'slowly revive', and maybe 2 to reviver faster. Slowly would consume like a few hours and fast would be a few minutes. This open space for being put in prison and stuff. That's possible. And if your body is destroyed, you'll revive at the bonfire as usual.

2) You die and go back to the bonfire, reviving while gaining 1 Karma. This is interesting because it generates complications for the group.

Both are equally possible. What do you think? I think it needs to be playtested. Me and my group were playing without resurrection rules, so I have no idea how a group would deal with it. Anyone would like to play and tell what happened?

Dungeon World / Re: Dark Souls hack
« on: November 07, 2012, 05:45:10 PM »
It's very hard to deal with it. When dying is one of the main focus of a game, it would be very hard to make it good. For example, if you are with the other PCs and you die, would the group go back to be with him?

That's not a very bad idea. Maybe the Karma can be used, instead as 'extra' hit points, as a track of 'deaths'. The game aludes that, if you die too much, you become hollow. So, if you lose all your humanity (gets 5+ karma), you would go hollow.

If karma cannot be used to reduce damage, death rate shall be gigantic. The player would die and reborn in the last bonfire, as in the game, but with +1 Karma. Hum... that could work.

Since this is not science, maybe some undead might not resurrect. Maybe, when you go hollow, you won't resurrect anymore? Maybe you must have the darksign to resurrect?


Dungeon World / Re: Dark Souls hack
« on: November 07, 2012, 05:26:52 PM »
Okasvi, the thing is that there are infinite ways for you to interpret the game. I've read theories that Lordran is the missing archstone at the nexus in Demon souls. I've also heard that Demon Souls is a sequel to Dark Souls and that the Dark Lord is the Old One from Demons Souls.

What do we truly now? That worlds are interconecting and heroes of the past and future are being able to invade each others reality, hence the multyplayer mechanic as it's explained by solaire, mister jolly sunbro cooperation.

I didn't put that question in the game because I didn't set the game in Lordran. I basically wanted, with this hack, that people explored the rest of Dark Souls world. I intend on making a future expansion focused in Lordran.

But, even so, I can't accept 'one' possible interpratation. I prefere to let it open ended and you can change and modulate the hack to accomodate the specifics of your table.

So, what you think?

Dungeon World / Re: Dark Souls hack
« on: November 07, 2012, 02:25:25 PM »
On the rpg, at the first pages, I explain that. I discarded the idea of 'dying and reviving' that exists in Dark Souls. I imagine that this exists mainly for the game have an excuse for the player to 'resurrect' every time he dies. The other npcs, when killed, don't come back, even those that are undead too. Maybe they don't have the dark sing?

So, you could say that the dark sign is needed for revive? Or is the darksing just a mark done afterwards you became undead? Many things are left unanswered in DS. In the rpg, I just say that you can burn humanity to heal and, if you lose all humanity (5+ Karma), you became Hollow. If you receive enough damage (5+), you die.

That was a design choice. But you can easily make so that, when you die, you lose a permanent point of Humanity, so you would become hollow with Karma 4. That way, you would make the idea of slowly becoming hollow after each resurrection. I don't like that idea, preferring that if you die, you die.

Dungeon World / Dark Souls hack
« on: November 07, 2012, 01:51:45 PM »
This was a tiresome work, but done with love nonetheless. It's not yet done, since it needs some more thinking with the miracles and sorcery.  I would like to hear your feedback, if you'd kindly give me some.

I intend, on the future, on doing the complete list of items from the game, the description of places, gods, personalities and the bestiary, would you people show interest on it, and also some rules on covenants.

Praise the sun, fellows. Umbasa!

Dungeon World / Re: Dungeonworld using 1d20
« on: November 06, 2012, 06:20:51 AM »
The thought sequence behind this idea is very simple: We used to roll less or equal in ADED for attributes tests. So, let's do the same with DW. But, since DW uses a 3 branched result tree, let's add the 1/2 success margin.

It's flawed, it's not balanced and it doesn't work well with DW, but it works fine with WD (world of dungeons), although flawed too. Since we play most of WD, with more improvisation than pre-set movesets, we used these rules for the fun of it. The mindset behind those rules are just 'simplicity' and 'fun'. I'm not saying that those lack in DW; on the contrary, I imagine both are inherent of it. I'm just elucidating the thought process that went into the 'making' of those rules. As you see, it was made at the heat of the moment where me and my players though: "Hey, you know what would be cool?".

And you can imagine that other ideas besides that one arose. There are other options, really, for a more 'balanced' way. If you want to emulate the 2d6 with 1d20, you can do as follows:

1-8 = Failure (40%)
9-17 = Tie (45%)
18+ = Success (15%)

In 2d6, the chances for F, T and S are, respectively, with a modifier of 0,  41,6%, 41,7% and 16,7%.

Every +1 bonus in the old 2d6, you can count as +2 in the 1d20. It's not a pixel perfect conversion, for the 1d20 is a linear progression, while 2d6 is not. But it works and it can be used as a more 'betterer' conversion of the DW rulesets.

You may even call those rules 'ADED 1d20', for the first, and 'd20 1d20', for the latter, even though they are not like those rules anyway. Maybe you can call it 1d20- de ADED and 1d20+ the d20, I don't know, lol.

Ps: I remembered other design choice behind the 'ADED 1d20'. Using the rule of rolling under the attribute requires almost none calculation, just matching the number with the attribute. I remember one of the players telling something about that and I riposting 'ok, so we can make like that'. It was cool at the moment.

Dungeon World / Re: Dungeonworld using 1d20
« on: November 05, 2012, 12:44:39 PM »
Why? Because it's fun using d20. It has a feel that no other dice can supply. It's something that brings us back to ADED, or at least the naive visions of ADED in ages past.

About the probability, let's talk a little about it:

These are the chances of a 2d6+0

2D6 Dice % of % Chance
Total Combos Result of this total or higher
2 1 2.8% 100.0%
3 2 5.6% 97.2%
4 3 8.3% 91.7%
5 4 11.1% 83.4%
6 5 13.9% 72.2%
7 6 16.7% 58.4%
8 5 13.9% 41.7%
9 4 11.1% 27.8%
10 3 8.3% 16.7%
11 2 5.6% 8.4%
12 1 2.8% 2.8%

As you can see, a chance of a weak hit (7 to 9) is about 40%, and the chance of a hit (7+) is 58%.

Most of the attributes in DW are above 10. If they are 10, the chance of a hit is 50%, and the chance of a weak hit is 25%, and the strong is 25%.

I use the spread of 15/13/11/10/9/8 at the starting characters. It's true that the probabilities are different, but it doesn't affect much of the game, at least in my games.

This is a cute idea, not a true mathematical transcription of the 2d6 usage to 1d20. Far from it. It's just as naive as once were players in ADED era. At least I was.

Anyway, you are free for ignoring it. You are also free to use the extra rule of the margin of success being 1/4 or 1/3 of the attribute. If you calculate the probabilities, you will see that the 1/4 is very close with the 2d6 use of the die. But I really don't mind with that.

Dungeon World / Dungeonworld using 1d20
« on: November 05, 2012, 12:25:45 PM »
I've been using in my sessions a variant of DW using d20 instead of 2d6. Basically, the rule is as follows:

When you try to do something risky, roll 1d20 and compare the number with the appropriate stat.

If number is higher than the stat, your result is Failure
If the number is equal or less than the stat, your result is a Tie
If the number is less than the success margin of the stat (stat/2, rounded down), your result is a success.

On a Failure, the MC makes a hard move
On a Tie, the MC makes a soft move
On a success, there are no consequences.

Basically, that's the World of Dungeons hack of DW, made by John Harper, but using the d20. You just need to use the values for the stats of DW but, instead of using the modifiers, you just use the raw value. Many players digged the idea of using the ol' d20. I, personally, am very fond of it.

For the modifiers of actions, every +1 is counted as +2 when using d20. So, if you have +1 when doing an action, it's +2 if you use this hack.

What do you think about this?

Here is a link to the WD (world of dungeons)

and a link to the WD of Warhammer

Apocalypse World / Re: Apocalypse World in French...
« on: October 14, 2012, 02:51:55 PM »
I have a question:

I tried sending an email for Lumpley asking exactly about that: what are the legality of publishing in other language?

I have a portuguese version of AW, not finished but mostly. I would like to know the details of the license or something.

Could someone help me?

Monsterhearts / Exchanging Skins
« on: July 19, 2012, 09:43:28 AM »
Hello. I would like to exchange any of the limited edition skins or homemade skins with my skins. Here is an image with 10 skins I've made:

I yet don't have neither the Hollow nor the Selkie skin, and would like them. Or, if you've made a skin, I would accept them too. Three of my skins are here on the forums (The God, The Ancient and the Nymph).

When you choose a skin, give me some time to translate, because they are in portuguese.

Monsterhearts / Re: New Skin: The God
« on: July 18, 2012, 11:13:31 AM »
Man, I was reading the move and I want that Bless and Bestow to be different moves. I think it would be a bit too much wide of a move to have so many applications. I can cut off the bestow from the god's list of moves, but I won't merge them both. It's, for me, just too powerfull.

And yes, the Miracle idea was that of having the faith of everyone.

About the Domain, I will have it the same way of the Ancient's Elder form and the Serpentine True Form. I will make it for you to choose the domain of your god and let free the option for 2 moves instead of 1.

When having a better name for Divine Shun, I will apply the changes on the skin. Do you have any sugestion for the name?

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