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Messages - higgins

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: January 02, 2013, 06:34:48 PM »
Well, sure. That gives the game a slightly grittier feel. I went pretty much for a swashbuckling theme. If Jack Sparrow slashes one pirate zombies in combat and knocks down the other, he does that with ease and no pre-planning on the moves. All he decides upon is that he'll engage at least one of them. That's the feel I was going for.

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: January 02, 2013, 04:06:09 PM »
Why would you need these moves?

No, I don't think you're doing anything wrong, however, there's a distinct difference between planning on dealing with two zombies and then making those two separate rolls... and planning on dealing with one, and then discovering yourself in a position that allows dealing with two. I just felt the spirit of DW lent itself better to the latter and that's the reason I created these rules.

Also, I wanted more grappling.

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 09, 2012, 12:18:31 PM »
That was an older version on the rules.   Current version is silent on the subject, as far as I can tell.

Well, in that case, the weapon will give whatever advantage it gives, via its enchantment etc.

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 09, 2012, 04:47:07 AM »
Hack'n'Slash 10+ result is base damage or base damage+1d6 and an attack from your adversary. Tangled meat is just +1d6, no downside.

These grapple rules aren't designed to be compatible with Hack'n'Slash. Look at the first post in this thread.

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 08, 2012, 03:27:46 PM »
Interesting.  So, your basic damage move in a grapple (10+ and you deal damage) is +1d6, no downside? 

I was under the impression that 10+ results don't generally have downsides =)

Wouldn't "get a strangle hold" imply "opponent doesn't scream out"?  Doesn't seem like both are required.  But if you want a separate one for preventing screams, getting only one choice from the list means there's no way to prevent screams AND end the fight. 

Ah, valid point. I intended the... scream prevention to be less violent, like... covering the target's mouth. Without that, the only way to silence a resisting princess would be to choke her out =D

What advantage do you get from having or not having a weapon in hand?  Presumably you assume something, or else "grab a weapon from ground or belt, getting +1 next round" is way inferior to just "get +1 ongoing for this particular grapple".

Weren't unarmed strikes just 1 damage?

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 07, 2012, 03:34:10 PM »
Boy, I got really carried away, but as DW completely lacks any grappling rules, I think it will be fun. A lot of messing with modifiers, but I think it models the grip advantages rather well.

TANGLED MEAT:

When you assault or resist in a grapple, roll +Strength.

On a 10+ you get to pick one of these:
- deal massive harm to opponent (+1d6 damage)
- get +1 ongoing for this particular grapple
- grab a weapon from ground or belt, getting +1 next round
- disarm the opponent
- throw the opponent, breaking grapple
- hold the opponent in a pain lock (he can't get free)
- receive harm, but break one of opponent's limbs (not neck)
- the opponent doesn't scream out
- get a strangle hold on opponent and get +1 to next roll; if you can maintain conditional +1 grapple related bonuses for two additonal rounds, he loses consciousness
- if opponent has a compact weapon in hand, direct it towards him and get +1 next round

On a 7-9 you get to pick one of these:
- deal harm while receiving harm
- get +1 to next roll, but receive harm
- avoid harm, getting -1 to next roll
- grab a weapon from ground or belt; GM chooses between dealing harm and giving you -1 next round
- you're disgracefully dragged away from an idle weapon, but can deal harm (I mean, this situation ALWAYS ends with a kick in movies, right?)

On a miss, the GM gets to use 10+ options, but to your disadvantage. All +1 results count as -1.

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 05, 2012, 03:36:30 PM »
It might be true that they are powerful, but I went with more of the swashbuckling genre here... which is pretty appropriate for D&D-style gaming. I mean, both these things would be doable by all Pirates of the Caribbean main characters in one combat or another, while Jack, Will and Elizabeth are obviously from three very different playbooks in DW terms. Plus I find it much more easier to have one comprehensive close combat move than... all the options scattered around several classes, which I'm bound to lose track of.

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 05, 2012, 03:19:32 PM »
Wheras, I'd rather let the options be the same across the board, but permit the activation of those through the fiction to differ.
Then it seems our design goals are polar opposite =)

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 05, 2012, 08:36:15 AM »
Isn't this like saying that the overly long and confusing "GM moves list" should be deleted and replaced with a generic advice of "Describe something unfavourable happening to the characters."?

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Dungeon World / Re: Improved combat moves
« on: December 05, 2012, 07:49:02 AM »
What about something along these lines, combining ranged and close combat?

I guess that's doable, but I much prefer the different methods of fighting feeling different as well. I haven't written up grapple yet, but... let's say in your version, I choose to "take a dominating position" and I'm also deciding that this position is grapple, with my character having a good grip. Now, I'm in a clinch with my opponent, but the outlook of the combat hasn't really changed, and the results of grappling are the exact same as the results of normal fighting.

I'm not sure why the focus is so specific on a single blow against a single target.

Who said that dealing harm is (or should be) handled with a single blow fiction-wise?

I mean, narratively "The captain of the guard and I fence for a few seconds as I drive him back down the stairs." is an extended exchange of blows, but still a single narrative action.

My rules model it just fine. Last two 10+ results achieve it, while making sure the situation doesn't remain static. Your rules don't model it... as on 10+ you also need to damage him or take away his equipment, or discard your 2nd pick. And on 7-9 the GM can either damage you or disarm you in return, or nullify the progress by picking a dominating position for the opponent in return.

And "I swing my claymore in through the tightly packed goblins, cutting through six squalling little bodies with a single blow." would be one blow, many targets.

My rules deal with up to two targets, and that's pretty generous swashbuckling spirit already. Any more of that, and I think suspension of disbelief would suffer... but if that's what you like, go for it =)

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Dungeon World / Re: Effects of non-damage combat moves: disarm, trip, etc
« on: December 03, 2012, 01:44:33 PM »
Defy Danger makes more sense to me as well. And I'd probably give the damage bonus on a 10+ roll. On a 7-9, I would give a choice: which does the thief want to accomplish more? That the ogre hurts itself or that the falls prone.

But yea, I'm glad you made this thread and I can't wait to see what the local folk here are going to suggest to your situations 1-4, as I've been struggling with those very issues.

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Dungeon World / Re: Effects of non-damage combat moves: disarm, trip, etc
« on: December 03, 2012, 01:07:53 PM »
Okay, so, in situation #5 the thief succeeds Hack and Slash to damage the ogre, and is assumed along with the same roll, to topple it as if succeeded Defy Danger as well. But what about the previous four situations that zmook asked? =)

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Dungeon World / Re: Effects of non-damage combat moves: disarm, trip, etc
« on: December 03, 2012, 11:00:14 AM »
I'd add one more situation that has been left unanswered so far:

5. It's the thief's turn. He wants to trip an ogre so it falls onto foot long spikes that are nearby. What move should the GM call for to match these intentions? How do you determine the amount of damage that the ogre would receive from the spikes?

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Dungeon World / Re: Effects of non-damage combat moves: disarm, trip, etc
« on: December 02, 2012, 12:48:33 PM »
1) page 20 has your answer. Unarmed character's do one damage. Weapons don't kill people, but they sure help.

Two questions:
a) What's the mechanic for disarming someone?
b) Does a disarmed FREAKING OGRE deal 1 damage as well?

What is the thief trying to accomplish? How does the thief do it? Does the thief knock the ogre into anything. Anyway, there went be stable combat modifiers because it's always going to be very dependant on the situation. Look at the fictional benefits of the things the players do, anything else will lead from there.

Okay, let's take two distinct situations:
a) Thief wants to knock ogre down, so that the fighter could kill it more easily.
b) Thief wants to knock ogre down, so it falls into some nearby spikes.
How would you handle them?

Yeah, I've always been unsatisfied with sysytems that are like "okay, you're Prone, the following penalties apply..." because they don't always apply. In DW, it's more like ?what are trying to do to the prone target? Okay, because he's prone that sounds easier..." It's muchmore common-sense based on the situation.

Okay, let's take the most straightforward option -- they're trying to kill it. Now, the ogre is down and... killing it "sounds easier" in fiction. How is it reflected in the mechanics?

As an aside, rolling Aid should never be boring.

But it... kind of is. Any tips you use to make it exiting? I mean, no matter the fiction, the result is always the same, right?

Edit: Sorry, if this seems like a thread hijack, but I've been struggling with those very issues and I believe I'm on the same page with OP.

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Dungeon World / Re: The Great List of Common Dangers?
« on: December 02, 2012, 12:25:41 PM »
Ah, yes, I had forgotten about that. Sounds like a great start. =)

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