L5R hack?

Anyone working on a hack of L5R? The starting stats would be easy - Earth, Air, Water, Fire, Void. Instead of races, have clans, and there are a variety of classes - Bushi, Shugenja, Monk, Courtier, etc. You could even go overboard and have separate classes for each clan - eg Crane Bushi is a different class to Dragon Bushi etc. The variant class paths could be advanced moves, the higher professions that give several abilities could be compendium classes.

Any other interest in working on this?

This is a great idea! Though I think the traditional playbook structure wouldn't be appropriate for character creation. Maybe each clan/school has it's own moves?

That would be an option.

I was thinking that there'd be several classes (Bushi, Shugenja, Courtier, Monk, Ninja, Artisan, maybe Scout since so many schools have those too), with Clans giving special moves, families providing a stat bonus, alternate paths providing advanced moves, and the advanced professions being compendium classes. You could even split some of them up a bit more - Bushi into duelists and heavy warriors, Courtiers into actual courtiers and merchants, that sort of thing.

We could have "classes" based on clans instead (Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn, Minor clans, Imperial clans, Monks and Ronin, for example), but then what do you do about eg a Shugenja's spellcasting and a Bushi's duelling skills?

A third option would be to have different classes come under each clan, so you have a Crab Bushi that's different to a Crane Duelist (though with some generally similar moves). That'd involve making up quite a few new classes though.

Here's bankuei's notes toward a hack:

http://bankuei.wordpress.com/tag/l5r/

here's a series by Brennan Taylor:

http://brennanrtaylor.blogspot.com/2011/10/hacking-apocalypse-world-to-legend-of.html
http://brennanrtaylor.blogspot.com/2011/10/l5r-to-aw-something-new.html
http://brennanrtaylor.blogspot.com/2011/10/l5r-to-aw-wealth.html
http://brennanrtaylor.blogspot.com/2012/01/l5r-to-aw-updates.html
http://brennanrtaylor.blogspot.com/2012/07/l5r-to-aw-seven-thunders.html

Cool! There's some great stuff there, thanks for posting those links.

I'd originally envisioned doing a hack based on DW, but having read Brennan's work using AW as the basis, I've swung around to his point of view. I'm doing some more work fleshing out a few things, including these, a first draft of other archetypes that aren't already covered. Please make comments, suggest changes etc.

Scout

A good scout is never surprised: When you Defy Danger in rural areas, roll+Sagacious instead of roll+Bold.

Pass without trace: When you hide in rural areas, or cover your tracks to evade pursuers, take +1 to your Defy Danger roll.

Observe the enemy's position: When you Read the Situation while observing your enemies, and act on the MC's answers, take +2 rather than +1.

Follow the path: When you track, hunt of follow the trail of someone who has gone before you - whether animal prey, your enemy, or in search of a lost comrade - roll+Sagacious. On a 7+, you follow their trail until some major obstacle blocks you - perhaps the trail suddenly ends, or the party being tracked arrives at a city, or a river blocks your path. On a 10+, your MC will tell you what happened here (eg they boarded a boat; someone was waiting here with horses, they split up and two went one way, while three went the other way). In either case, make another roll to continue tracking if circumstances allow.


Ninja   

Concealment is second nature: When you hide yourself from sight, take +1 to your Defy Danger roll.

Poison!: You start with 1D3 doses of any of the following poisons, and when you have a spare few hours, and the right ingredients, you can make another 1D3 doses of a particular poison. Each dose, when administered, causes the following effect:

• Dripping Poison: Trickled down a thread into the mouth of a sleeping enemy, this poison causes 2 harm (ap) and affects the person with a -1 to Strong for the next 24 hours.
• Fire Biter: When added to a weapon, wounds caused by it always generate terrible harm. This can be in addition to the terrible harm which you may choose on a good Fight roll.
• Night Milk: When ingested, this poison causes deep sleep within ten minutes, and lasts for 6 hours or until the person afflicted is roused with vigor.

Acrobatic Strike: When you Fight, roll+Bold rather than roll+Strong.

Ghost in the Night: When you need to get away, roll+Sagacious and name your escape route. On a 10+, you get there unscathed. On a 7+, you get there but not without cost - you leave something behind, take a 2 harm wound or give away your identity (your MC will tell you which).


Magistrate

Magistrate's Papers: When acting in an official capacity in an investigation, take a +1 to Read a person.

Ongoing Investigations: When you act on the MC's answers after Reading a situation or Reading a person, take +2 rather than +1.

Do you know who I am?: When using your official position to Threaten, roll+Sagacious rather than roll+Strong.

At your disposal: With rank comes perks: You start with Post with Aides. If you choose the Post with Aides move later, take +1 to your Aides rolls.


Artisan

Craft Object: You are skilled in creating a certain type of objects (weapons, armor, paintings, cabinets, buildings etc). Each session, roll+Elegant. On a 7+ you create a nice looking usable object of the type you specialize in. On a 10+ you create a masterpiece that can be sold for 1 wealth above its normal value.

Patron: You have a patron who allows you to concentrate on your art. Each session, you may choose whether to receive 1 wealth or 1 favor from him or her.   

A study in scarlet: When you closely observe an item of the type you specialize in, you can learn one thing about it - who made it, whether it has any peculiar properties, who it was made for, etc.

A dangerous flaw: When you observe an object of the type you specialize in for a short while, you may spot a flaw or weakness in its design. Take +1 forward when using this flaw or weak spot against your target. Examples: You note that the armor your enemy is wearing was a weak spot to the left of the chest - add +1 in your Fight roll against that opponent; You notice that the foundations of the building are sagging a little in a certain point; destroying that corner post will bring the entire building down on a successful roll+Strong move; The new vase that the Crane courtier is showing off dos not follow the proper color palette, point this out and take +1 in your next Negotiate at Court roll to cause them loss of face.


Sumei

Fists of Steel: When you fight unarmed or with small weapons, add +1 Harm.

I recognize your style, and can overcome it: When you Read a person after watching them Fight, take +2 forward when acting on what you learn rather than +1.

As tough as steel: When you Fight unarmored, you always count as having 1 armor.

Large and imposing: When you Threaten someone and use your size and build to do so, take +1.


Everything in these archetypes is up for change, so if you have any comments on changes, even just to names of moves, please feel free to do so.

I would have thought using the rings would be a perfect fit for an AW hack. All of the basic moves can be encapsulated by the ring traits:
Air = act under fire
Fire = go aggro, seize by force
Water = seduce/manipulate
Earth = read a sitch, read a person
Void = open your brain

It's not exactly a perfect fit but I'm just spitballing from memory. I'm at work as I write this so if I had my L5R books in front of me I'd probably re-write the basic moves to fit the setting. For instance, instead of "seize by force" it would likely be "duel" and instead of "open your brain" it would be "meditate." Then you tweak the moves to fit the setting a bit more, maybe even shuffle some moves around and add a few more to fit with the original social/physical split dynamic of each ring...

nerdwerds - if you look at Brennan's blog, you'll see he's done something similar to that on moves. I started off thinking that Earth, Air, Water etc would be good fits, but then read up on what Brennan had said when he decided on his stats (Strong, Bold, Elegant, Sagacious, Blessed) and it hit the mark with me. It's immediately obvious which stat governs which type of move, for example, and using the L5R stats themselves doesn't necessarily fit well - there's no need for initiative type stats in AW for example.

In other news, here's the Hiruma Scout school I've knocked up as a draft:

Hiruma Scout

Moves:

Rank 1: The Bounty of the Land. When in wilderness areas, you do not need to consume any rations – you will always find some form of sustenance, even in the harshest circumstances. You also have an unerring sense of direction, even in the Shadowlands.

Rank 2: The Eagles sees All. When you observe an enemy’s position, you can Read a Person in the enemy camp, and when you act on the MC’s answers, you take +1 forward against that person.

Rank 3: The Land Protects. When you Fight in the wilderness, you use the terrain to your advantage, dodging behind rocks, using trees as cover, picking slippery or rough ground that inconveniences your opponent. Count yourself having an extra +1 Armor because of these advantages.

Rank 4: One with the Land. When in wilderness areas, as long as you have some form of cover or camouflage and you do not move, you cannot be seen.

Rank 5: Hidden Strike. When you attack from hiding (such as when using the One with the Land move above), your attack is treated as a roll of 12+, and you ignore any armor your opponent is wearing. You can then make a Defy Danger roll to escape back into hiding.

Scout Improvements:

___ Get +1 Bold (max Bold +2)
___ Get +1 Strong (max Strong +2)
___ Get +1 Sagacious (max Sagacious +3)
___ Get a new Scout Move
___ Get a new Scout Move
___ Get a Move from another Archetype

Hiruma Scout Improvements:

___ Get +1 Strong (max Strong +2)
___ Get +1 Bold (max Bold +2)
___ Get +1 Sagacious (max Sagacious +3)
___ Get a new Hiruma Scout Move
___ Get a new Hiruma Scout Move
___ Get a new Hiruma Scout Move
___ Get a new Hiruma Scout Move
 

Starting stats, pick one set:

1 Strong +2, Bold 0, Elegant -1, Sagacious +2, Blessed -1
2 Strong +1, Bold +1, Elegant -1, Sagacious +2, Blessed 0
3 Strong +1, Bold 0, Elegant 0, Sagacious +2, Blessed 0
4 Strong +1, Bold +2, Elegant -2, Sagacious +2, Blessed -1

Here's another school, the Kitsuki Investigator. As always, comments are always welcome.

Kitsuki Investigator

Rank 1: The Kitsuki Method. When investigating a scene, take a +1 to Read the Situation.

Rank 2: Tell-Tale Signs of Deception. When you successfully Read a Person, you always ask if the person is telling the truth without spending a hold.

Rank 3: The Mind Recreates the Scene. Once per session, you can ask your MC “what happened here?” and he or she will tell you. You probably won’t be able to tell you murdered the Daimyo, but you will be able to discern how it was done, and might pick up clues as to who could have done so.

Rank 4: Trace the Path. You can uncover networks of alliances or feuds. When you Read a Person, you can ask “who is this person’s ally / enemy?” and the MC will give you the name of one such individual that the person is connected to through alliance or enmity. Each additional  hold you spend will give you the name and nature of the relationship with another person, and whether they also have a relationship of some sort. For example, you read Doji Ichiro and spend 3 hold to discern that he is an ally of Hida Koro, Matsu Tenku and an enemy of  Bayushi Aiko, and that Koro and Tenku are also allies, and that both are also enemies of Aiko – could the three allies be part of some Rokugan-wide conspiracy? And why is Aiko their enemy?

Rank 5: Tear Away the Veil. When you Read a Person and they attempt to lie to you, not only do you immediately spot it, but you can cut through their bluster and force them to admit their role in a crime they have been involved in (if they are truly innocent, you will discover this). In addition, if someone you have met before is disguised in your presence, you see through their disguise immediately as their insignificant mannerisms give them away.

Magistrate Improvements:

___ Get +1 Elegant (max Elegant +2)
___ Get +1 Bold (max Bold +2)
___ Get +1 Sagacious (max Sagacious +3)
___ Get a new Magistrate Move
___ Get a new Magistrate Move
___ Get a Move from another Archetype


Kitsuki Investigator Improvements:

___ Get +1 Elegant (max Elegant +2)
___ Get +1 Blessed (max Blessed +2)
___ Get +1 Sagacious (max Sagacious +3)
___ Get a new Kitsuki Magistrate Move
___ Get a new Kitsuki Magistrate Move
___ Get a new Kitsuki Magistrate Move
___ Get a new Kitsuki Magistrate Move


Starting stats:

1 Strong -1, Bold -1, Elegant 0,  Sagacious +2, Blessed +2
2 Strong -2, Bold +1, Elegant +1, Sagacious +2, Blessed +1
3 Strong -1, Bold 0, Elegant +1, Sagacious +2, Blessed +1
4 Strong -2, Bold 0, Elegant 0, Sagacious +2, Blessed +2

nerdwerds - if you look at Brennan's blog, you'll see he's done something similar to that on moves. I started off thinking that Earth, Air, Water etc would be good fits, but then read up on what Brennan had said when he decided on his stats (Strong, Bold, Elegant, Sagacious, Blessed) and it hit the mark with me. It's immediately obvious which stat governs which type of move, for example, and using the L5R stats themselves doesn't necessarily fit well - there's no need for initiative type stats in AW for example.

He still gives an elemental ring that matches with the stat though, so when you say Bold you might as well be saying Fire, and I don't think some of his moves line up with the rings very well. Now that I have my L5R rulebook in front of me, the rings seem like they match the basic moves perfectly thus:
AIR = read a person, seduce/manipulate
EARTH = defy danger
FIRE = go aggro, "duel"
WATER = read a situation, seize by force
VOID = meditate

There's only one stat that deals with initiative. More problematic to convert are the clan abilities that change turn order, or the Void abilities that reset initiative or adjust your initiative number. I think these are easy to ignore (or fix) as there are plenty of non-initiative uses for these rings and abilities.

Brennan is right about his duel move being kind of weak. In every game of L5R I've played in master duelists were to be avoided if you didn't know how to duel, but if you were matched with somebody of equal level it was a toss-up. I think the 'success/success with consequence' format of AW works well for this, because you could easily say that a PC who isn't normally a duelist fighting a master would have 'survival' as his 'success.'

"Meditate" could easily work just like "open your brain" but instead of asking questions the player could hold 2 or hold 1 and then spend 1-for-1 for:

• +1forward
• -1harm
• +1armor
• one-time use of a move from the character's own playbook
• one-time advance of a basic move (before it's rolled)

Pretty simple really. YMMV.

Another thing I just noticed while flipping through my L5R book is the concept of raises. This is hard to translate into AW because there are so many tiers of success in L5R, but I would say you could add a simple option that any player could activate for any roll.

Raise: take -2forward and the 7-9 result of a roll gets upgraded to a 10+ result

Not sure how balanced that is for 2d6, but the concept of taking a penalty to increase your effect of success is there.

when you say Bold you might as well be saying Fire, and I don't think some of his moves line up with the rings very well. Now that I have my L5R rulebook in front of me, the rings seem like they match the basic moves perfectly thus:
AIR = read a person, seduce/manipulate
EARTH = defy danger
FIRE = go aggro, "duel"
WATER = read a situation, seize by force
VOID = meditate

I'm not sure they fit either - especially Defy Danger. Go Aggro, which depends on physical strength or the threat of such, would be more apt for Water too, I'd think.

There are too many cases like this with the L5R rings I think, which is why I moved away from them to using Brennan's stats (Bold, Strong, Elegant, Sagacious, Blessed) which match up nicely with the moves they're tied to. I'm basing the stuff I do on the work he's done, not only because a lot of the heavy lifting lifting has already been done, but because it's a nice, simple but elegant solution to what I want to cover anyway. The way Brennan has it, there are 10 basic moves and 5 stats, with 2 moves per stat so that no stat is overly important or under-powered, for example.

One thing I will say in favor of using the elements versus the other style of stats is that- at least for what I'd like to accomplish in the Oriental Adventures-style hack I'm working on- it adds a different flavor, something more cosmic I guess. Especially if they fluctuate instead of certain stats advancing. It depends on what you're going for. I'm going for something more cosmic and poetic, where others might be looking for something a little more crunchy and detailed. Certain things don't have to line up perfectly, that's what hacking is all about- to get your own game out of it!
A bit of my story:
I started doing a lot of work hacking the original Oriental Adventures setting into Dungeon World. It was pretty straight forward for a while, I just cobbled together the different moves for the different classes that corresponded, and added new ones that reflected different unique things in OA. The classes were samurai, shukenja, wu jen, kensai, bushi, barbarian, ninja and yakuza, and there were a few different races. Then things got a little sticky, because there were cool things that I wanted to add, like the proficiencies from OA/D&D, and the honor/family system, martial arts, psychic duel etc. I wanted it to be innovative at the same time as being classic and faithful to OA, but I couldn't do all of that and have it be as elegant and comfortable as DW without making a lot of revisions and changes to the system. I thought that using the elements would be a really cool way to do the stats, but I eventually just set the whole thing aside to work on other stuff.
I just started thinking about it again but in simpler terms. Making it more of a "mythical Japan" setting rather than a L5R or Rokugan hack (but still being inspired by the original classes and stuff). Lone Wolf and Cub is also a big influence.
For me it would be less about the customization and options for all the classes and more about how those classes deal with honor, duty, mysticism and the other classes. Basing it off of AW instead of DW was a better way to go, so I'm starting in again, glad to see you guys are working in the same realm.

I'm not sure they fit either - especially Defy Danger. Go Aggro, which depends on physical strength or the threat of such, would be more apt for Water too, I'd think.

One thing I will say in favor of using the elements versus the other style of stats is that- at least for what I'd like to accomplish in the Oriental Adventures-style hack I'm working on- it adds a different flavor, something more cosmic I guess.

More like, eastern philosophy.
I used to run L5R for newbies and the biggest hurdle for people unfamiliar with the system was that each ring had both a physical and a social component. Once you see that each ring has a philosophical idea behind it the uses behind the ring start to make more sense.

I assigned "Go Aggro" to Fire because Fire is the element of destruction. Thus most weapon skills in L5R are based off of Fire even though Earth measures raw strength. In L5R, Earth is used to recover from wounds but also for grappling and wrestling, and thus could easily apply to "Seize by Force"

If you sit down and read the descriptions of the rings, it's almost like the basic moves of AW write themselves into the rings. (I've got both the 1st and 4th edition rulebooks, and the descriptions are virtually identical.)

More like, eastern philosophy.
I used to run L5R for newbies and the biggest hurdle for people unfamiliar with the system was that each ring had both a physical and a social component. Once you see that each ring has a philosophical idea behind it the uses behind the ring start to make more sense.

Exactly. The AW stats are similar. Like, Hard isn't just physical, it's the attitude that goes along with it- killer instinct etc. That's one of the things that I dug when I first played Apocalypse World, the emphasis was on intent and attitude.

I'm working on another hack/setting that uses descriptors that go along with the stats. I might try that to go with the elements.