Can a non-Savvyhead use a Workspace?

It's obvious I can build one... Find a junkyard, tools, maybe a crew to work on stuff (hell, the Driver has an improvement for this), but once I build a "workspace" could I go in and use it like a Savvyhead?

And, I'm talking descriptively building a workspace, not prescriptively getting one (through a Driver's improvement for example).

Can a non-Savvyhead use a workspace?
For that matter, can the Driver use a workspace (once he takes it as improvement) as though he were a Savvyhead?

As in, if I buy a garage, I'm suddenly an amazing techhead guy.

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

As in, if I buy a garage, I'm suddenly an amazing techhead guy.

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

That's not what I said.

Shall I post the convo?

Quote from: Chris on August 11, 2010, 12:33:25 PM

As in, if I buy a garage, I'm suddenly an amazing techhead guy.

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

That's not what I said.

Shall I post the convo?

nah, let's see what other people have to say.

Quote from: Chris on August 11, 2010, 12:33:25 PM

As in, if I buy a garage, I'm suddenly an amazing techhead guy.

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

That's not what I said.

Shall I post the convo?

The question comes from this:

If I'm a brainer, and I spend barter to buy a garage and a van and controlled growing environment, then can I just make things?

Right?

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

The example move we used was an Angel's "Infirmary" move.

Chris is fine with a player rolling Hot 5 times to "earn" an Infirmary, but not with an Angel spending 5 sessions negotiating with the Hardholder to earn a space, working on people to earn enough barter for a medical station, and fucking people enough to get them as assistants to "earn" an infirmary.

I disagree. Obviously. It's heated. We come to the boards for arbitration.

Quote from: Chris on August 11, 2010, 12:33:25 PM

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

The example move we used was an Angel's "Infirmary" move.

Chris is fine with a player rolling Hot 5 times to "earn" an Infirmary, but not with an Angel spending 5 sessions negotiating with the Hardholder to earn a space, working on people to earn enough barter for a medical station, and fucking people enough to get them as assistants to "earn" an infirmary.

I disagree. Obviously. It's heated. We come to the boards for arbitration.

Nah, an Angel CAN make an infirmary descriptively. That makes sense. But can a skinner? And then just fix people?

How far does the descriptive/proscriptive thing go?

The question comes from this:

If I'm a brainer, and I spend barter to buy a garage and a van and controlled growing environment, then can I just make things?

Right?

That's kind of a gross hyperbole of my question. It was more like this:

me:  Maybe I'll multiclass into Savvyhead and make it myself. ;)
Chris:  there you go
hnmmmm
you can;t
I remember why Vincent changed it
Workspace isn't a mvoe
move
hahahaha
me:  Right, it's just an object. I could build a workspace right?
Then I just need the moves to back it up.
 Sent at 12:06 PM on Wednesday
Chris:  no, see the savvuhead CAN make shit because they get a workspace
it's not a move
it used to be
early on
then vincent changed it
what moves back it up?
me:  Right, but a workspace is just "three things" a van, a darkroom and a controlled growing environment...
Chris:  yeah
but that how you make shit
you can put together a warehosue
me:  So, if I got some of those things, like... say a "junkyard" and a "van" etc...
I'd have a workspace right?

Quote from: Michael Pfaff on August 11, 2010, 12:46:12 PM

Quote from: Chris on August 11, 2010, 12:33:25 PM

Also, Michael and I talked about gaining moves descriptively...

I'm against it; thoughts?

The example move we used was an Angel's "Infirmary" move.

Chris is fine with a player rolling Hot 5 times to "earn" an Infirmary, but not with an Angel spending 5 sessions negotiating with the Hardholder to earn a space, working on people to earn enough barter for a medical station, and fucking people enough to get them as assistants to "earn" an infirmary.

I disagree. Obviously. It's heated. We come to the boards for arbitration.

Nah, an Angel CAN make an infirmary descriptively. That makes sense. But can a skinner? And then just fix people?

Wtf? You said they couldn't. You wouldn't allow it. You said you'd never allow anyone to take a "move" descriptively.

me:  So, you'd never let an Angel get an "Infirmary" fictionally because it's a move?
Chris:  hmmm
me:  That's retarded imo.
Chris:  no
me:  :)
Chris:  I wouldn't it
I mean, it's not meant to simulate reality
me: I mean, you can MC how you want. But if I were MCing and a player went out of his way in the fiction to secure a location, some medical supplies and a crew, I'd give them that move.
OBVIOUSLY his "circumstances and capabilities" have fictionally changed.
Chris:  maybe
me:  He should change his sheet to match.
Plain. Simple.
Chris:  I mean, it breaks the game
 me:  I don't think it breaks the game at all.
Chris:  I'm not going to bother with moves or improvements
why HAVE the game
we can play and if it happens in fiction, then it does
me:  You're getting those things by PLAYING the game.
Chris:  it's not a game anymore
me:  Maybe I'm PLAYING to get an infirmary?
Chris:  it's a story
me:  What matters if I do it by rolling fucking Hot 5 times or by doing it over 5 sessions of roleplay?
Hilarious.
:)
Chris:  But that breaks the reason to take it as a move
I would never do that then
me:  Not really.
Chris:  why would I

---

But check it, let's not rehash our argument. Let's let some other peeps chime in. I'm super interested in how the whole Descriptive vs. Prescriptive battle pans out.

A non-savvyhead can use a workspace.

The crucial check on it is "but first you'll have to figure out ___."

-Vincent

Ahhhhhhhh.

So first the brainer is gonna need like 3 years of engineering school. Good luck.

Ahhhhhhhh.

So first the brainer is gonna need like 3 years of engineering school. Good luck.

So long as I CAN do it fictionally, I'm happy.

Thanks for the quick response, Vincent.

A non-savvyhead can use a workspace.

The crucial check on it is "but first you'll have to figure out ___."

-Vincent

And taking moves descriptively? Like how far does that go? Is it GM fiat, I guess? Because if it is, Michael's not getting shit.

In fact, I'm changing my principles to "Michael never gets what he wants". That's the only one. :)

"GM fiat" is a bullshit term. (No blame! It just is.) Descriptive improvement isn't subject to GM fiat -- that's just bullshit.

Descriptive improvement is the GM's call, legit and aboveboard, subject to the GM's agenda and principles.

And taking moves descriptively? Like how far does that go? Is it GM fiat, I guess? Because if it is, Michael's not getting shit.

In fact, I'm changing my principles to "Michael never gets what he wants". That's the only one. :)

Hasn't this been your principle in all of our games?? :)