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Messages - nerdwerds

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Urban Shadows - A Modern Dark Fantasy game / What's your game like?
« on: February 03, 2020, 07:04:54 PM »
I'm interested in hearing some stories about groups that have played Urban Shadows. Please share some here!

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No takers?


I'm just seeing this thread now. Without reading all the responses here, I *have* had this happen in a game. The player thought maybe he could just finesse taking over a hold without taking the associated improvement, and I never told him he couldn't make the attempt, but I did make it explicitly clear that he would not get barter from being in charge until he took the move ("What honesty demands"). Basically, I treated the whole thing as an invitation to make new threats, it was a lot of fun and I spent a great deal of time looking through crosshairs and responding with fuckery and intermittent rewards.

For example, he can say he's in charge, and if he's got a big gun people will be pushed around face-to-face, but as soon as he would leave the populace would plot against him and actively undermine his authority. He got fed up and started bombing buildings (he was a Driver with an APC) and that's when an open revolt occurred. By the end of it he took the improvement, but his holding had been decimated - mostly by him - so I told him he'd either have to have a small population or make his gang +savage. I forget what he took, but he spent the rest of the game regretting the rebellion he created.

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...and it maybe too late for nerdwerds's game, ...

Yup. I went with the idea that the Driver can sense the threat type of a vehicle, but I didn't give it to the player as a move. Whenever he gets into a car I just say something like "You feel like this buggy wants go fast" for a ferocious fucker or "You feel like this APC wants to crush skulls" for a vicious bastard and I've found that it provokes the player into asking questions and making moves. Which is kind of what you want players doing anyway, so it works perfectly!

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Apocalypse World / Re: The Landfall Marine
« on: August 09, 2017, 10:19:32 AM »
Hey! I made a legal-size trifold version, here is a link

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Keep in mind that vehicles have threat types now (page 113).
Maybe the driver can see the type of threat it is? or determines it?

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Apart from the Driver's sex move, there is nothing inherently "loner" or "I don't like being tied down" in the Driver playbook. If a Driver never has sex, they can be committed to anything and anyone they choose.

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What I meant is, feel free to hate it, hack the old one back, etc. ...
So like what you want, hate what you want. ...
I didn't say I hated it, I said the 2nd edition version seems like it is missing something. It starts out weaker comparatively then the other playbooks but the Driver no longer has a starting move that gives him a unique edge when he's in a vehicle.

Driver has plenty of things, and if you and your player cannot figure out what he wants his to be, then, maybe a brain storming session is due.
Have you not read what I've been typing? We're not trying to figure out what his character wants to be, we can't figure out why the Driver seems to start as a lesser playbook than the rest. There is no "thing" or gimmick that is unique to the Driver. If the Driver's specialty is being mercurial and separate then why is it called the Driver instead of the Loner.
(Also, I told my player to just take an extra Driver move of his choice to balance out that half the other players have vehicles too)

If I were to give a Driver a "thing" I'd probably focus away the cars and give him instead a "Name".
This is the most ridiculous statement. I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying because you love the playbook too much to really have enough emotional distance from my criticism of the playbook.
 
The Savvyhead starts with a workspace
The Maestro d' starts with an establishment
The Hardholder starts with a hold
etc.
The Driver starts with a car
BUT when every playbook can potentially start with a car that no longer becomes unique, and they are no longer special. The Driver has lost their "thing," their gimmick, their specialty.

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Apocalypse World / Re: the Driver has lost their "thing"
« on: July 26, 2017, 07:35:34 PM »
Sorry, further comments in the other thread since it was there first.

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Before, the Driver was a handicapped cheat. Things were too easy behind the wheel, and there was nothing once he stepped outside the car.
That was never my experience with it. I played a Driver and got screwed on many of my rolls, also the only character I ever played who died (in his car even).

No. I dont think I need to persuade anyone.
Abjectly false statement since you typed out a response.

The Drivers moves now let him be whoever he wants to be. It lets the player decide how they wanna roll, and if that's locale, then so be it. Reputation, Escape, Big ass toys; It's fucking awesome. Driver decided he wants some heavy fucking machinery to do construction work around town, deciding he's part of say a savvy heads agarage and they're do big things here. Fuck yeah, it's what I've got to say. No savvy head? Meh, still all the same, just pick up your own workshop through the moves and do it that way.
This sounds more like it. You make a good point, the Driver does have a bit more freedom now that the Operator's moves have been handed over to the playbook.

I still think freedom isn't the Driver's "thing" or else the Driver's freedom wouldn't be a hindrance from the sex move. Freedom should be revelatory, not anxiety-ridden. Or maybe it should have the freedom to be either, but the Driver playbook makes your interpretation of freedom almost obligatory.

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The Driver has lost their "thing" - they used to be a badass behind the whell of any vehicle but now they feel like the most generic of playbooks.

I'm not seeing a lot of reasons in this thread for what makes the Driver so special - using the rules themselves.
"The Driver is mobile"
"The Driver is a loner"
"The Driver makes the world larger"
These are unique perspectives based on what people played and how they interpret the playbook, but not how the playbook is written.

I've got a Driver in one of my current games and he has literally never left the town he started in and he has spent all his time putting down roots and making a name for himself. Every single thing people define Drivers as in this thread is refuted by this one player (who has also never played AW before and so he's not coming to the game with baggage or preconceptions of *how* he's supposed to play a Driver). Yet, he is also kind of shafted because the other players (a Brainer, a Hocus, a News, a Maestro d' and a Savvyhead) all have their "things" that make them special. Starting with a vehicle didn't even make the Driver in this game special because both my Brainer and Savvyhead asked to start with vehicles, and now the Hocus has even managed to acquire a bus for his family.

I'm tempted to just give the Driver combat driver for free since that's the most driver-y move, and he's managed to avoid taking it simply because he hasn't gone anywhere and he has no compelling reasons to. Believe me I've tried to lure him out, but he's a single-minded player.

I hated the Driver playbook before. Now it's one of my favorite. So... disagree. :)
Your entire post here is weighed down with how you perceive the playbook. As I said in the other thread, personal preference doesn't carry any weight with me. I would really like to know what the 2nd ed version has for you that the 1st ed doesn't.

Almost makes me wish we had some version of the Moonlighting move to handle the type of person who gets their hands into all kinds of pots...
I'm gonna write one.

Paul, a question. The Driver isn't the only immensely mobile playbook. Do you have similar issues with the Chopper?
The Chopper also starts with a decent Cool, there is very little separating the two mechanically. One starts with a car, the other starts with a bike (and a gang).

I feel like a Driver who spends a whole game without driving the car around would be... somewhat disappointing, at the very least.

...

With the Driver, I'm not sure what the focus IS, except for "I have a cool car and I don't like being tied down."
The player of my aforementioned Driver has expressed dismay that his "thing" is that he starts with a car. He's mentioned several times that he wishes he started with a different playbook because he doesn't see what the appeal of the Driver is since there are other characters that started with vehicles, and he thought starting with a car would make him more unique. (He added a prosthetic to his character to give him an extra layer of coolness: a laser eye that he uses to spy on people whenever he opens his brain.)

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Apocalypse World / Re: the Driver has lost their "thing"
« on: July 26, 2017, 07:12:49 PM »
I saw the words "skinner effectiveness" and just rolled right past that topic. Oh well.  :-\

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Apocalypse World / Re: the Driver has lost their "thing"
« on: July 26, 2017, 07:08:18 PM »
Sorry Paul, if I had seen that thread I wouldn't have posted this. Even in that thread, I'm not seeing a lot of reasons for what makes the Driver so special from the rules themselves.
"The Driver is mobile"
"The Driver is a loner"
"The Driver makes the world larger"
These are unique perspectives based on what people played, not how the playbook is written. I've got a Driver in one of my current games and he has literally never left the town he started in and he has spent all his time putting down roots and making a name for himself, so literally every single thing people define Drivers as in that thread is refuted by this one player (who has also never played AW before and so he's not coming to the game with baggage or preconceptions of *how* he's supposed to play a Driver). Yet, he is also kind of shafted because the other players (a Brainer, a Hocus, a News, a Maestro d' and a Savvyhead) all have their "things" that make them special. Starting with a vehicle didn't even make the Driver in this game special because both my Brainer and Savvyhead asked to start with vehicles, and now the Hocus has even managed to acquire a bus for his family.

I'm tempted to just give the Driver combat driver for free since that's the most driver-y move, and he's managed to avoid taking it simply because he hasn't gone anywhere.

I hated the Driver playbook before. Now it's one of my favorite. So... disagree. :)
Convince me that the new Driver is better Ebok. Personal preference doesn't carry any weight with me.

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Apocalypse World / the Driver has lost their "thing"
« on: July 26, 2017, 10:34:43 AM »
In 1st ed, the Driver was a badass behind the wheel of a vehicle and outside was subpar in stats and weaker in effectiveness.

In 2nd ed, the Driver seems to be Cool, but that's about it. Especially since a lot of playbooks can potentially start with vehicles now, there seems to be no incentive for playing the Driver except that they can possibly build a fleet of vehicles.

Every playbook has a THING, a gimmick that makes them special. The Angel has their kit, the Brainer is a psychic, the Chopper has a gang, etc. What does the Driver have that the other playbooks don't? I can't see it. The Driver has been neutered.

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Apocalypse World / Re: Sunken Sydney, a Hatchet City-style scenario.
« on: July 24, 2017, 08:28:21 AM »
My hero!

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Apocalypse World / Re: Sunken Sydney, a Hatchet City-style scenario.
« on: July 23, 2017, 12:24:06 AM »
This link appears to be broken, or disabled. Does anyone have a copy of this pdf they could send to me?

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