The Rich Tag

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The Rich Tag
« on: January 15, 2017, 06:06:20 AM »
One option for the Chopper's gang is to gain the +Rich tag. What does this do to the chopper's need to pay upkeep costs or ability to earn jingle? As leader of a rich gang, I can't really see the chopper being in the same position (earnings or expenses) as other less fortunate gang's. That said, I don't think they are like the Maestro'd in that I don't think they can sit around and just have the jingle roll in, so I'm leaning towards more productive gigs.

What are everyone's thoughts?

Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2017, 02:45:57 PM »
One thing I've done while running for a Chopper with a rich gang is to greatly remove the internal pressure I normally put on a Chopper from their gang to go out and proactively get plunder, because the rich gang has independent sources of income while the not-rich gang blows through their reserves pretty quickly.  This means the Chopper with a rich gang has a fist when they need it, but has less need to be constantly worrying about how scarcity is screwing their gang.

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Ebok

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Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2017, 06:58:19 PM »
Never had the opportunity myself, however, I agree with nweismuller.

The Rich tag should basically mean, these guys have something to lose. That something has value, to them and to other people. It means they're not so desperate on the edge of life and death, but it also means they keep circling what's important to them. It changes the focus what can find on the road today, will it be enough. to: Did we find what we were looking for? Did we keep everything safe?

For me richness tends to mean they become localized a bit more. They have a place, and that place has stuff. It's not the Choppers stuff, its the gangs stuff. Thus its not like a hardhold. In this case, maybe its just families, crops, land, whatever. But while rich chopper gangs might not be as desperately aggressive, they're still very much protectively aggressive. It becomes a lot more about what keeps them rich then how to get rich in the first place. Anyway, this will have very real effects when it comes to what orders the gang might resist, and for what reasons they might resist them.

In short, a Rich gang does not mean the Chopper doesn't pay his share. His gang doesn't support him. They each support themselves together.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2017, 07:39:32 PM by Ebok »

Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2017, 02:24:38 AM »
I feel like I'm of two minds about this. On the one hand, I like the idea that it changes the dynamic of the gang. You aren't having to use Pack Alpha to get them to do things outside of making jingle, because the gang has enough to not be worrying constantly. But on the other hand, I wonder what this means for the chopper. If you didn't take rich, are you always better off than your gang members? Kind of like a you eat first and they get the scraps kind of deal? It seems weird that the chopper as the gang's leader wouldn't be benefiting from them being rich.

That said, I could see being rich effecting move like Fucking Thieves. If the gang always has some jingle, it seems solid that you could use your move to get them to cough it up.

The reason I bring this up is that I'm considering having my chopper's gang be +loyal and +rich. The backstory being that my chopper recruited out of a local handhold and taught them the trade, as it were. Unlike other road gang's they specialize in going places no one else can or wants to, where the scavenge is good and the passers through are crippled by the terrain. People can leave as they want, ala "If you want out, there is the door." Partially this is because people don't want to walk away from a good thing, partially because they have to deal with the hardholder, and partially because keeping people around who want out is bad for their own health.

So yeah, kind of an odd gang. Not so much 'true outlaws' as 'local boys on dirt bikes who want a piece of the pie for themselves.'

Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2017, 05:21:23 AM »
Well, as far as benefits to the Chopper themselves... Dominic, the Chopper in my last game, had a rich gang that had claimed a ruined city that was still actively scavenged as their territory.  I periodically allowed 'squeeze the scavs in the ruins' as a gig for him with minimal risk, rather than having to go out and do something excessively exciting to get jingle.  Sometimes, a relatively safe and reliable way to earn some jingle that has no risk of losing some of your people is really worth quite a bit.

Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2017, 05:52:46 AM »

Combined with your other post about motorcycle tags, I feel like it's worth pointing out that the main function of these sorts of tags and choices is to help spur you towards concrete ideas about the gang (or the motorcycle or the weapon or whatever) -- and once you have those specific ideas and choices, the tags are just there to remind everyone what those specific choices were.

So if you already have an idea about exactly what your gang is like, you don't really need to worry if '+rich' really means one thing or another -- if you take +rich and describe your gang, then that's what +rich means, exactly. There's no secret hidden meaning of +rich that is somehow going to undermine your vision for your gang, or provide opportunities or mechanical effects other than those that follow from your description of the actual gang and how they actually operate in the fiction. You're the one who decides if the tag makes sense, and you're the one who's going to explain to the MC what that tag means for your specific gang.

Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2017, 08:41:16 AM »

Combined with your other post about motorcycle tags, I feel like it's worth pointing out that the main function of these sorts of tags and choices is to help spur you towards concrete ideas about the gang (or the motorcycle or the weapon or whatever) -- and once you have those specific ideas and choices, the tags are just there to remind everyone what those specific choices were.

So if you already have an idea about exactly what your gang is like, you don't really need to worry if '+rich' really means one thing or another -- if you take +rich and describe your gang, then that's what +rich means, exactly. There's no secret hidden meaning of +rich that is somehow going to undermine your vision for your gang, or provide opportunities or mechanical effects other than those that follow from your description of the actual gang and how they actually operate in the fiction. You're the one who decides if the tag makes sense, and you're the one who's going to explain to the MC what that tag means for your specific gang.

I can't say I agree with the philosophy behind this at all. If +rich has no meaning other than to help me describe the gang, well then I could simply describe it without the tag and take something with narrative & mechanical weight. In my mind there should be a compelling reason to pick something. A or B is only a good question if you want both A & B. If being rich means the gang is more complacent, that is something I can value against better armor or weapons. If it's just window dressing that does nothing, then I have no reason to value it as an option.

Further, it's hard to decide what to chose when you don't know what you are picking. Thus my search for clarity, because I was assuming that the tag actually conferred some kind of benefit (even if only in fictional positioning). Maybe this is a conversation best had with my MC, to discover what they want to do with the tag.

Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2017, 01:22:18 PM »
your gang’s self-sufficient, able to provide for itself by raiding and scavenging. It gets +rich.

Rich (cue): outside of battle, the gang always has a little scratch, a little jingle.


Yes, you should check with your MC. Here are some things that implies to me as a straw-MC:
I'm not going to expect the Chopper to chip in towards the lifestyle cost of the gang or maintenance of their bikes unless he also took one of the drawbacks that brings those concerns back into play like vulnerabilities to breakdown, grounded or obligation. Otherwise that note about a few months maintenance on a vehicle being 1-barter is a hard move (take their stuff) that I have in reserve. 15 bikes take maybe 5 barter a month to maintain. Most of the time it's background detail but when I need something to throw at The Chopper, there it is. Failed that manipulate roll? Rolfball will refuse and remind you that your gang has been going through a lot of parts lately. He's been ok running up a tab so far but now the bill is due before he'll do any more work and it's (1, 3, 5, whatever) barter. Don't have it? Better go get it before the gas tanks are empty.

The gang always has enough stuff around to get a few drinks at the Maestro's Establishment or similar. Without it, they get drinks by going into the bar and clobbering anyone who gets between the and the hooch or by the Chopper either paying or using Fucking Thieves to come up with something valuable.

The key phrase to me is self sufficient. Without that, at least some of the cost of lifestyle and maintenance for 15 violent bastards and their bikes falls to the Chopper.

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Ebok

  • 415
Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2017, 06:19:14 PM »
More to nail the point home, Rich should NOT provide the chopper with a subsidized lifestyle. It may describe a richness that the gang as a whole has access to (including the chopper), but these do not generate barter so much as change the dynamic of the gang.

If they want wealth like a holding, they best go get themselves one the side, and even then I'd not change the weekly barter consumption, the holding can be rolled to provide that barter, or the narrative complications therein.


Re: The Rich Tag
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2017, 06:22:32 PM »
Yeah, the basic Chopper cost of living doesn't change but keeping the gang at full strength may increase it when the opening presents itself.