Level Up

Yes, good point. That's the source of frustration I've seen at the table, I think.

When someone highlights the Gunlugger's Hot, he's all, "Huh, okay, why not?" Opportunities for seduction and manipulation are abundant to him.

When someone highlights the Wizard's Strength, she's all, "Uh. Thanks a lot, asshole." It's a total waste. The Wizard is the wizard, and she's not gonna go running around stabbing stuff just because someone checked a box.

I agree that this does not feel as strong as the rest of the game. I'd like to see something like a combination of alignment, class, and goal associated xp rewards like keys.

If the goals are the same per level, but fairly general, I'm not sure it'd be repetitive.  Can anyone list a few of what we're talking about?

Is it like the wizard might check off 'unravels a magical mystery' or 'creates a magical item' and the fighter might check off 'prevails in a difficult combat' or 'keeps the rest of the party safe' and stuff?

That's one take, definitely. My per-level ones were a little more focused and became grander with level. First level evil wizard has "Bend someone's will with magic," not a big thing. Second level evil wizard has "Sacrifice a creature for magical power." etc. That's probably too dramatic a change, sacrificing might wait for higher level.

Another example: first level wizards can "Have the right knowledge at the right time," second level "Discover a secret from an earlier age."

These are just from my email to Adam, quick first drafts. I worry that writing a lot of them could be very tough (8 per level x 9 levels to advance through).

Yeah, writing all that sounds like a real chore.

But if you could come up with twelve general ones, where you need five to level and you can't use the same option two levels in a row, you could prolly write twelve per class, right?

i like the new idea for leveling. it has very good potential but a fear that they might end up pigeon holing classes into acting a certain way. but if they are general enough that should not be an issue! but again i really like the idea!

i also really like the alignment xp from this game. i think a way to keep that feel would be to have a list of general actions that is augmented by a few from the alignment. just an idea.

i agree with john harper for a change against marking stats. in the sessions we had where someone got a stat they actually use marked they shot up way too fast in XP (like 20-30 a session...) while everyone else got less than ten. my other issue is the general moves themselves. this has already been mentioned, but a fighter with his wisdom marked can discern realities with impunity but a wizard with strength marked cannot willy nilly go stab the minotaur. (basically its easy to force tests for mental stats than it is for physical ones)

I think I agree on the stat-highlighting being wrong for the game play.

I have added some custom moves to the game I'm DMing to emphasize exploration and discovery:

Discover a New Place
When you discover a new place in the world, mark experience.

Fight a Monster for the First Time
When you fight a monster for the first time, mark experience.

Of course, these are open to anyone.

I dig the Fight a Monster for the First Time move but the Discover a New Place seems too vague and I would expect players to argue for "discovering" every room they enter.  Also, if a player spouts lore about a monster, could you screw a player by asking "What happened the last time you fought this monster?"

I dig the Fight a Monster for the First Time move but the Discover a New Place seems too vague and I would expect players to argue for "discovering" every room they enter.  Also, if you spout lore about a monster, could you screw a player by asking "What happened the last time you fought this monster?"

Eh. My game is sort of "West Marches" style I guess. Discovering a new place ... It doesn't mean like, Ooh I discovered this new restaurant, awesome. No, it means uncovering a dungeon or other adventure locale on the map.

Spouting Lore doesn't necessarily imply that you got the knowledge from fighting the monster. It's more about legends, tales and fables, tomes and other fonts of knowledge.

In my campaign, the assumption is everyone is sort of beginners I guess, so it works.

What if each class, alignment and race had lists of these how to level up things and either got them all or selected some number of them to distinguish your character.  To avoid the pigeon-holing issue, I mean.

My neutral human ranger maybe chooses five from the neutral alignment, five from the ranger and two from the human lists, sort of emphasizing that neutrality and rangerness is more important than humanity.  Or maybe that's more complicated than is needed.  Dunno.

Anyone wanna write up an example of a list? I'm sort of having a hard time imagining these things.

I've pondered "achievement" style leveling before, but it'd be neat to have a frame of reference.

Rangers:

_ You lead others on a dangerous trip into and back out of the wilds.
_ Your animal companion saves your life.
_ Your Called Shot either ends or avoids a perilous melee.
_ You live off the land for an adventure.
_ During combat, you protect the life of someone in your care.
_ Your knowledge of the wilds brings you material gain.
_ You detect something hidden.
_ etc..

Awesome.

This is a lot like keys from The Shadow of Yesterday by Clinton R. Nixon, except you'd get xp each time you hit one of them. I'll have to re-read that to get some ideas.

Should they be called "experience moves" or something like that?

I'm thinking of using something like this in my game, except you still have to gain the normal amount of experience to level up. Maybe the first time you hit one, you get 3 xp, and after that you only get 1.

Yup. Alignments are already pretty much Keys you can't buy off. There are also a few XP moves that aren't alignments, but those are a little rare these days.