Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack

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JBH

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Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« on: September 16, 2016, 09:58:27 AM »
I've put together this hack, based on AW2 preview material, for running a spaghetti western game with my group. It is a quick&dirty thing, meant for private use only, but it should be usable (as it is mostly a straight AW2 ripoff, which seems naturally well suited to western from the get going).
The main changes are renaming of archetypes, some tweaks to them, the Weird stat replaced by Wild and a couple of custom moves for wilderness exploration and showdowns. 

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BzE-wIzHvKIcY0ppaW1zM0dId2M

I don't know if this is the right section in the forum for this, by the way. If not, feel free to move it elsewhere, please.

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2016, 06:52:31 AM »
v2 is up with a couple of fixes for a Doc move (Healing Touch) and a Gunslinger move (Battle Instinct), which both had too much AW left into them.

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2016, 12:27:27 PM »
v3 is up with tweaked Go Trailblazing move and reworked Showdown move.

Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2016, 05:17:01 AM »
Nice Western reskin!

I especially like how you re-worked Weird into Wild and made the Trailblazing move.
Using the Savvyhead to make the Native is an interesting and cool choice with the use of 'the Land'.
The way you organized the combat moves seems much cleaner and simplified than AW2ed.

The Showdown moves are interesting. I like the Staredown phase before exchanging fire. However I'm not sure if the results of the moves are quite right. I don't like how Hard determines who fires first in the second phase. I think Cool should determine who gets to shoot first. Cool seems more having to do with reflexes and looking cool. Hard has more to do with intimidation and the will to deal hurt. On the other hand, I can see the reasoning behind using Cool for the Staredown because well, the Staredowns in Westerns are just cool!

So I might think about the Staredown phase actually using Hard and the options being: Force your opponent to go for their gun first and/or, deal +1harm in the exchange of fire during the second phase (if there's an exchange of fire).
Then in the Shootout phase, roll +Cool. On a hit, you draw first. On a 10+ your draw is quicker and everyone knows it, whether you shoot your opponent or not is up to you. On a 7-9 you shoot.
–I feel this covers the showdowns where the hero is so fast and cool that the opponent knows he's at the hero's mercy and there's not even necessarily an exchange of fire. He went for his gun then suddenly loses heart when he sees he's in the hero's sights and he barely cleared his holster.

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2016, 10:52:39 AM »
Glad you are liking it. I tried to go as light as possible with the reskin here, as I though there was already a western within AW: it just needed a little spin to come through. We have finished our run with it and it went quite well, definitely above expectations.
I see your point about the Showdown move. I think we agree this needs to involve both Cool and Hard. Either ways work. This was a tough move to pull together in a way that would work both for dueling with NPC and in PVP - hope I managed to. So far we only had one in real play and the player rolled two 12s in a row, so well, not much for anecdotal evidence (but it was fun :-)).

Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2016, 10:53:43 AM »
This is actually a really interesting reskin!

I like a lot about it, and the rules match the source material quite well. (Although I'm not 100% convinced about all the playbooks, like the Gunslinger - I would probably omit a few if I were to play this.)

A few comments:

* The AW rules are built so that your Weird is always increasing, far more so than the other stats. You've changed Weird to Wild - a nice change! - but is it appropriate to a Western that the endgame has everyone becoming more and more Wild?

* It might be nice to have some kind of Animal Handling move based on Wild, as well. (For horse taming, standing down a bear, etc.) "Tame the Beast", perhaps? I don't know if it should be a Basic Move, but it would give another interesting use for Wild (I could even see using it to deal with someone hopelessly drunk, for example!).

* I agree that the Showdown move is very interesting - and I like how you've broken it down into two segments of action - but I'm not sure what the options are for. Is drawing first all about looking calmer than the other guy? What about shooting first? Is it just narrative colour, or does it change the outcome of the showdown? (For example, if I "shoot first" and I "disarm" my opponent, do I still exchange harm?)


Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2016, 10:56:18 AM »
Also, I'm not sure what augury does, if there's no psychic maelstrom!

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2016, 12:52:26 PM »
A few comments:

* The AW rules are built so that your Weird is always increasing, far more so than the other stats. You've changed Weird to Wild - a nice change! - but is it appropriate to a Western that the endgame has everyone becoming more and more Wild?

* It might be nice to have some kind of Animal Handling move based on Wild, as well. (For horse taming, standing down a bear, etc.) "Tame the Beast", perhaps? I don't know if it should be a Basic Move, but it would give another interesting use for Wild (I could even see using it to deal with someone hopelessly drunk, for example!).

* I agree that the Showdown move is very interesting - and I like how you've broken it down into two segments of action - but I'm not sure what the options are for. Is drawing first all about looking calmer than the other guy? What about shooting first? Is it just narrative colour, or does it change the outcome of the showdown? (For example, if I "shoot first" and I "disarm" my opponent, do I still exchange harm?)

* Also, I'm not sure what augury does, if there's no psychic maelstrom!

Good points. Thanks.

Regarding characters becoming more 'Wild' as they go on, it kind of makes sense to me (it is the Wild West after all :)). However I'm wondering if there need to be a custom move based on 'Wild' that allows to accomplish astonishing feats, at a cost.

Animal handling: yes, I thought about it, but then didn't want to add too much over the AW framework (also considering it already provide moves for mounted combat). However if you have idea for animal handling moves that can be cool.

Showdowns: pulling first is a bad as that technically makes your a murderer (while the other would be just firing in self defense). Shooting first is important as it may prevent the other from firing altogether (if killed or disarmed).

Augury: you are right, it is just a leftover from AW that I need to amend. However it may make sense for someone like the Native to be able to perform Augury in some cases (like in a spirit quest).

Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2016, 02:14:30 PM »
Yeah, I read Augury as a spooky shaman move within this context.

Also w the Showdown stuff, I would make a clear distinction between "Going for your gun" first and "Drawing your gun" first. Which is what I think you're going for based on the source material. "Pulling" & "Shooting" aren't as clear to me in the context of a showdown.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2016, 02:45:33 PM by Gavinwulf »

Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2016, 02:39:53 PM »
Good answers.

Rewording "augury" as a Spirit Quest sounds fantastic (I don't think a pure reskinning will work quite right, however).

The visual design/layout of your booklet is really appealing, by the way. How did you do it?

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2016, 07:45:17 PM »
Very good feedback. Thanks, guys.
Regarding Augury, I agree it would need to be replaced by another custom move, but for the time being I'm just going to remove it. I'm however considering bringing Insight back in (as it would fit fine here) and rename the last Native move to Vision Quest, using it.

Vision Quest: some component of your sacred ground, or some arrangement of its components, is uniquely receptive to the land (add insight). Choose and name it, or else leave it for the MC to reveal during play.

I've been rethinking about the Showdown move upon the comments and I'm considering moving the draw&shoot to the Staredown phase, so it doesn't mean it automatically hits. Here is how it may work:

SHOWDOWN
When you face off with someone in a gunfight duel, roll+cool to engage in a stare down contest. In PvP both roll+cool, choosing secretly from one another (contradicting choices cancel out). On a 10+, choose 2. On a 7-9, choose 1. On a miss, the other chooses 1 against you.
• You force the other to go for their gun first (so you can claim self-defense).
• You draw and shoot first in the shootout (before exchanging harm).
• You take +1 forward.

When the stare down is resolved, proceed to the shootout: exchange harm, but first roll+hard. In PvP both roll+hard, choosing secretly from one another (contradicting choices cancel out). On a 10+, choose 2. On a 7-9, choose 1. On a miss, the other chooses 1 against you.
• You inflict terrible harm (+1harm).
• You suffer little harm (-1harm).
• You disarm the other, but inflict little harm (-1harm).

Regarding the formatting of the playbooks, it is just a Word doc exported to pdf (sorry to disappoint :-)). I use the Playbill font for titles and Modern No. 20 for body of text.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2016, 08:33:34 PM by JBH »

Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2016, 08:22:00 PM »
That's certainly a lot clearer! Good work.

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2016, 06:03:33 AM »
Happy it seems to make sense. I've promoted the changes into v4, which is now up. Thanks !

Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2016, 06:53:13 AM »
I wonder about the Showdown Staredown

If I roll 10+ and you roll a miss, does that mean that I pick 3? Or that I pick 2 for myself and 1 for you?

If it is the second, I'd suggest to reformulate the first choice as:

• You delay your draw so the other go for their gun first (allowing you to claim self-defense).

Just because I find it weird that I might decide that you "force" me to go first.

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JBH

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Re: Frontier World - a (Spaghetti) Western AW2 hack
« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2016, 07:20:36 AM »
I wonder about the Showdown Staredown

If I roll 10+ and you roll a miss, does that mean that I pick 3? Or that I pick 2 for myself and 1 for you?

If it is the second, I'd suggest to reformulate the first choice as:

• You delay your draw so the other go for their gun first (allowing you to claim self-defense).

Just because I find it weird that I might decide that you "force" me to go first.

The way I see it, you pick 3: two for the 10+ and one for the other missing.