I think most people, especially people who play roleplaying games, come at things from the lego/starcraft, build-it-just-because sort of angle.

Wow, pegged me dead on there...

So that was mostly all I meant to say -- that it's fine not to worry about the answer right away, and that probably the answer has something to do with why you stuck with that particular 'cool' thing longer than the others. Answering the question for yourself is a good start to answering it for other players.

Very cool - I think I get where you're coming from now. I'm still not grocking the issue of appeal to players though. If you have a "cool" idea that is sticking with you, how to you turn it into something that gives the players something to work with? In D&D, the play factor is "kill stuff, level up, get sweet loot, repeat." In AW its "play to find out what happens to hot, crazy characters in a world without stable civilization" (as you so aptly put it Daniel). In Lady Blackbird its "find out how this dynamic situation resolves, in the backdrop of this crazy cool sci-fi/fantasy setting," and in Dread its "get excited in the tension of watching the inevitable get closer and closer to consuming you."

I think I might be trying to divorce "player appeal" from the rest of the game, which probably isn't productive. But still, I feel like there is a part of the puzzle between "cool over arching concept" and "final game that gives the people playing it something interesting and compelling to do" that I'm missing...

Am I over thinking this?

Part of what makes it feel very one-colour is how abstract most of the basic moves are. Basic moves are usually the go-to place when you want to figure out what characters actually DO in the game. It may not be obvious, but your basic moves all feel slightly more abstract than their AW equivalents -- 'corrupt shit' and 'exploit vulnerability' are particularly notable -- and combined with the idiosyncracy of your general setting/premise it makes it difficult to imagine what play actually looks like. (In some cases the moves may not be significantly more abstract, but instead lack a clear context in my mind due to unfamiliarity with the general sort of world/stories you're aiming for.)

This is really good feedback - I'd love it if you could toss me some suggestions on how to shore up the specificity of these

Anyways, if you're going for 'hilarious dark debauchery' I think you need a lot more hilarious

Yeah, I think my initial write up for this world got a wee bit too morbid. I do like the idea of "cute things gone wrong," but this might come out better if it was more along the lines of things like Conker's Bad Fur Day (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conker's_Bad_Fur_Day) or Fairytale Fights (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glG8N4MinwM)

 I guess I don't really know what the reason to play is other than to laugh at the shock value of cute shit doing messed up things (geez, am I a bad person?). Again, the End Path moves were intended to give a direction to play, but I don't know if they really give a reason to play.

  A lot of this game idea come from playing video games with very simple motives (kill stuff, move forward) that have the twisted-but-funny flavoring. What would the motive of someone living in a twisted world be (or I guess more appropriately, what would be an interesting motive to play out)?

The Barfer and Stitcher aren't so bad, since they at least come with a concrete, visualize-able action, but 'Defiler' (much like 'corrupt shit') just doesn't mean anything.

I definitely realized that the Defiler was kind of bland. I did come up with another character that I think is more along the line of what I am trying to get across

Check it out:


A spoiled little brat who isn't used to not getting his or her way.

Stats
• Filthy +0, Bloody +0, Nasty +1, Slippery +2, Twisted +0 (mean-y)
• Filthy +0, Bloody +1, Nasty +1, Slippery +1, Twisted +0 (hitter)
• Filthy -1, Bloody -1, Nasty +2, Slippery +2, Twisted +1 (manipulator)
• Filthy +0, Bloody -1, Nasty +2, Slippery +2, Twisted +0 (psycho)

You Get This:
• Listen to ME!!!
  o When people need to stop what they’re doing and LISTEN TO YOU, roll +Nasty
  o 10+: Everybody stops what they’re doing. You get to act however you want before they come too.
  o 7-9: You’re distracting as fuck. Everyone gets -1 to whatever it is they’re trying to do.
  o Miss: You’ve called attention to yourself, but not the good kind.

And two of these:
• Pretty Little Princess
  o You’re such an innocent little sweetheart. When you try to weasel your way into or out of something, gain 1 delight.

• Can I have that?
  o When you really want something, roll +slippery
  o 10+: If an NPC owns it, you get it. If a PC owns it, you get +1 ongoing against them until you get it.
  o 7-9: If an NPC owns it you can have it for a little while, but then you have to give it back. Also, they get 1 dominance over you. If a PC owns it, you get +1 forward against them to get it.
  o Miss: You’re a spoiled little girl. In fact, you need to be taught a lesson!

• Vicious little Mongrel
  o You get +1 Bloody

• Cunning Little Snake
  o If you try to interfere with someone who’s rolling, roll +slippery instead of +infatuation

• Childish Glee
  o You can cash in Delight for Decadence on a 2 to 1 basis instead of a 3 to 1 basis.

• But. I. WANT IT!!!
  o If you don’t get something that you want, roll +slippery
  o 10+: Someone consoles you (for god sake!). Choose 1 of these
    • Get something of value 2 or less
    • Get 1 delight
    • Get 1 dominance (spend it on the Fuck with People choices)
    • They gain 1 infatuation with you
  o 7-9: Choose 1 from the list above, but also 1 of these
    • You get 1 depravity
    • They get 1 dominance over you

Thoughts?

Hi all,

  GURPS markets itself as a complete universal role playing game, but the system has a strong emphasis on representing real world physics and the like. FATE is also marketed as generic, but emphases a somewhat theatrical approach to gaming. While AW itself is very specific, I kind of feel like the underlying mechanics of the game serve to facilitate any number of games with the emphasis on simulating a particular feel of play (color first gaming).

So:
GURPS - Setting agnostic, Real world physics focused
FATE - Setting agnostic, theatricality focused
AW's System Mechanics - highly hackable (so system agnostic), color focused?

Thoughts?

-Jamil

Hey Simon,

  Yeah, the appeal of the setting is definitely not wide reaching.

On this:

I think you need a reason for people to play other than wallowing in awfulness.

  I tried to counter this by adding the End Path rules. This may just not be your type of game, but I'd be interested to see what kind of things you think would give people a solid and interesting reason to play.

On this:

So I'd say it's potentially a nice start, but right now it's very monotone. You could take this as a starting point though and work out towards something more multidimensional.

  I was surprised to hear that this came off as monotone to you. I'd love to hear what you feel it was missing. My goal was that "hilariously dark debauchery meets technicolor vomit" would be enough to keep things moving in-game, but I could definitely see how this wouldn't work for anything longer than a session or two. Maybe this would be better as a single-session hack?

continued...


Healing: If you eat pure, un-tainted food, you gain 1 life. Otherwise, you don’t heal unless a Stitcher tends to you.

Stuff
Weapons
  • Dinky Little Thing: 1 damage
  • Standard Shit Kicker: 2 damage
  • Big Fucking Kill-Stick: 3 damage

Armor
  • Weak: 0 armor
  • No Bad: 1 armor
  • Heavy Duty: 2 armor

Life (6 point ladder)
  • Bruised Up
  • Black and Blue
  • Something Cracked
  • Beat to Shit
  • A Fleshy Pulp
  • At Death’s Door

Creatures (things that live in the twisted world)
Throbbers (want to fuck things)
Blood Bursters (want to hurt things)
Gapers (want to watch things)

Continued...


Stats
  • Filthy: revel in it
  • Bloody: Break, Hurt, or Slaughter
  • Nasty: Fuck with people, exploit vulnerability
  • Slippery: Avoid detection, Weasel In or Out
  • Twisted: Corrupt Shit

  • Infatuation: how much people like you (and hence how much you can control them).

Other Currencies
  • Dominance (temporary control over others)
  • Delight (can spend at any time for +1 bonus, or can cash in 3 for 1 experience)
  • Depravity (GM can spend to fuck with you)
  • Decadence (experience stand in)

Use of a Highlighted Stats give +1 delight


Break, Hurt, or Slaughter
  • When you want to break something important, hurt somebody who sees you coming, or cut through bitches, Roll +bloody.
  • 10+: Choose 3
  • 7-9: Choose 1
     o You fuck shit up (+1 damage)
     o It can’t be normally repaired (doesn’t work on PCs)
     o You don’t get hurt in the process (with breaking shit, take 1 damage [ap] if this option isn’t taken)
     o Bitches Flee (doesn’t work on PCs)
     o They can’t stop thinking about you (+1 infatuation)

Revel in It
  • When there is gross shit going on, and you want to revel in it, roll +filthy.
  • 10+: Its delicious. Get +1 life, mark decadence, or +1 delight
  • 7-9: Its good, but its fucking filthy. Choose 1 from the 10+ list, but also choose 1 of these:
     o +1 depravity
     o -1infatuation for all present
  • Miss: That did not feel as good as it was suppose to. In fact, you feel kind of sick now...

Fuck with People
  • When you want to fuck with people, be it through a direct conversation or indirect manipulation, roll +nasty.
  • 10+: You get 3 dominance
  • 7-9: You get 1 dominance
     o Spend Dominance whenever you like to get the following:
        • (NPCs) They do the thing you tell them to, unless its fucking suicide
        • They’re where you want them to be, when you want them there (for PCs, you can add them into an active scene, or say they are not in a scene with you)
        • Answer my question honestly
        • (PCs) Do what I say and mark decadence.
        • (PCs) Don’t do what I say and take -1 forward against me

Exploit Vulnerability
  • When you want to exploit vulnerability, roll +nasty
  • 10+: Choose 3
  • 7-9: Choose 1
     o Hurt them badly (2 damage ap)
     o Show them you own them (+1 dominance)
     o Give them Stockholm syndrome (they get +1 infatuation with you)
     o Take something they own away from them
     o Don’t get caught for it

Avoid Detection or Attention
  • When you want to avoid detection or attention, roll +slippery
  • 10+: Nobody sees or notices you
  • 7-9: Only 1 person saw or noticed you.
  • Miss: your caught doing whatever it is you didn’t want to be seen doing.

Weasel Your Way Into/Out of Something
  • When you want to weasel your way into or out of something, roll +slippery
  • 10+: If you’re going in or getting involved, you get there, exactly where you want to be. If you’re getting out of something, you’re off the hook or out of harms way.
  • 7-9: If you’re going in or getting involved, it happens, but not necessarily where you want to be. If you’re getting out of something, things don’t go exactly as planned: the gm will give you a tough choice or a nasty alternative.
  • Miss: You fail at what you’re going at, and are caught in a bad place because of it.

Corrupt Shit
  • When you want to corrupt shit, making it worse than it already was, roll +twisted
  • 10+: It will never be the same. If it used to serve a function and you don’t want it to, it doesn’t.
  • 7-9:  It’s different now (and nastier), but not how you expected.

End of Session Moves
At the end of each session, go around the table and have everyone pick out which character they were impressed or intimately hurt by. That person gains +1 infatuation with you.

Additionally, mull over your actions in the session, and the MC and other players will decide together which End Path you followed most. Gain 1 point in this end path.

There are three End Paths
  – Escape (from The Weird)
  – Sovereignty (over The Weird)
  – Embrace (of The Weird)

Once one of these End Paths reaches 5, your play with that character ends according to the path fulfilled. Narrate your characters end, and make your final move.

End Game Move
  • When you reach an end path, roll +relative stat (for Escape, roll +slippery. For Sovereignty, roll +nasty or +bloody. For Embrace, roll +filthy or +twisted).
     o 10+: You meet your end path head on, owning it in whatever way you want.
     o 7-9: You meet your end path, but not in the way you wanted to. Bummer man.
     o Miss: You meet your end path in the worst possible way. Shame…

Hey all,

I just started up my first game of Vincent Baker's Apocalypse World! I went for a fairly customized setting backdrop for the game, and figured I would post the setting blurb and custom rules here in case anyone is interested or wants to toss out some feedback.

First off, here is the introduction to the setting:

Into Darkness

"It was about 50 years ago. At least, I think. I’m sure some fucker out there is keeping a record, but that fucker sure isn’t me.

Anyways, about 50 years ago, the dark patches started popping up. People called it things, like “meteorological anomalies” or “solar apertures” or some shit. Later, they started calling it “judgment” or the “end of days”, but that was later. First there were only a couple, then more. They started growing. Then people realized that the darkness could hurt them. That’s when people started freaking out.

It’s something in the darkness. Or some things. Or fuck, maybe just the darkness itself. Whatever. It fucks with you, messes with your head, takes you away and does horrible things to you. Sometimes you just die (lucky fuck). Sometimes it makes you do thing, hurt those you love or take away the things that make you human. Sometimes you get strung up, organs hanging out your ears and still beating heart pumping blood to your screaming eyes and tongue-less mouth.

People fell into chaos. The military was sent in, but they weren’t ready. How could they be? Even if they were, it probably wouldn’t have really mattered. The darkness kept spreading, gobbling up more and more of the world. Soon the days started to get shorter and the sun started to fade. People panicked – fucking and stabbing and killing each other just to get their hands on a flashlight or a lantern. They didn’t even think about food – yet. It wasn’t long before telephones and the Internet stopped working, and then people realized just how fucked we were.

So now we live by candlelight, afraid to venture beyond the dying campfires and the draining flashlight batteries that keep the darkness (and what’s in it) at bay. But that’s the fucked up part – the darkness isn’t the most dangerous thing.

No, the real danger lies with your fellows; that weird skinny fuck who keeps biting his nails till they bleed; that creep ass priest who keeps offering confession for sexual favors; that gang down the road that makes you pay taxes for your charcoal and batteries; that big, angry looking dude who keeps staring at you whenever you clean out your rifle – these are the fuckers you need to worry about.

But I mean, we’re alive at least. That’s something right? Hope for a better future and all that shit. Wait, hold on a sec – this guys trying to lift my canned peaches – I gotta go beat this fuckers ass real quick…"

So naturally, a world like this has a particular feel that could use some custom rules. So, here's what I came up for it!

Peripheral Darkness Rules

Light Sources
Sprinting through the dark without a light source for a short distance: -3
A lit match, candle, or lighter: -2
A weak flashlight, or makeshift torch: -1
Some Christmas lights, a handful of light sticks, or a few small light bulbs: +0
Gas or kerosene lantern, strong flashlight, or well-made torch: +1
Electric Lantern, flare, or heavy-duty flashlight: +2
A large, bonfire-sized flame: +3
Aid of a Spotlight: +4

Take -1 for every 2 people you are trying to shelter in your light

Custom Moves:
Entering the Darkness
Whenever you have to enter the darkness, roll + Light source
• On a 10+, you made it to your destination safely.
• On a 7-9, the darkness creeps in. The MC chooses 1
    o The experience leaves you shaken; -1 ongoing until the next dawn
    o The darkness reshapes your path; you arrive later than you wanted to
    o The path becomes rugged and dangerous; take 1 harm (ap)
    o Whispers get in your head: the darkness takes 1 hold against you
• On a miss, things get bad. Something bad happens and the darkness takes 2 hold against you.

Take Hold of Your Soul
When the darkness has hold on you and wants to influence your actions, it can spend a hold and try to take hold of your soul.  To resist, Roll +cool.
• On a 10+, you’re fine, for now. The darkness loses its spend hold.
• On a 7-9, I tell you what to do. If you do it, mark experience. If you don’t, you’re acting under fire from brain weirdness.
• On a miss, you come to some time later; having done whatever the darkness wanted you to do.

Custom Character Moves:
Weird, twisted mind: When the darkness tries to take hold of your soul, roll +weird instead of roll +cool
Get out of my FUCKING HEAD: When the darkness tries to take hold of your soul, roll +hard instead of roll +cool
Wait, I can beat this: When the darkness tries to take hold of your soul, roll +sharp instead of roll +cool.
The Pleasures of Sin: If you ever act with the darkness instead of against it, roll +hot. On a 10+, choose 2. On a 7-9, choose 1.
• You get away clean – nobody knows it was you who did that horrible thing.
• You relish the experience utterly. Mark experience.
• The act leaves you feeling refreshed. Gain +1 ongoing until the next dawn.

(thus far, my idea for the custom character moves was to have them be available to any character as part of character advancement.)

I also created a single sheet moves page for the darkness rules above. You can download it at http://www.weebly.com/uploads/1/4/1/4/14148728/peripheral_darkness_rules.docx if your interested.

That's pretty much it. I just wanted to share how much fun I've had in just the first session, share the setting idea with others in case anyone thinks it would be fun to run/play, and open myself up for feedback on the setting/design elements.

-Jamil
http://brainstreamgames.weebly.com/