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Messages - Orion

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16
blood & guts / Re: Too many cooks... OR (help: not always helpful)
« on: August 23, 2010, 04:37:10 PM »
Interesting! That does, obviously, change the statistics completely.   

17
Apocalypse World / Re: Seize by Force and Harm
« on: August 22, 2010, 01:52:56 AM »
Yup.  Brainers and Battlebabe's even get moves for going aggro.  TO answer the question about seizing by force safely, however

--make sure to choose "take little harm". 
--There are a lot of moves that give armor.  If your Brainer is comfortable with her completely unacceptable status in society, she could get the Battlebae's impossible reflexes move and run around in underwear all the time.
--Your savvyhead can and should use her workshop to *make some armor* if she's fighting a lot.  Daredevil can stack on top of that if she's an especially bold type. 
 

18
Apocalypse World / Re: Help me understand the logic behind advancement?
« on: August 18, 2010, 06:24:46 PM »
Eggdropsoap,

Your proposal makes intuitive sense to me, but I'm fairly sure Vincent doesn't play that way. As he describes his own play, you're *not* making a statement about the other players' taste, you're playing your character "naturally," which in this context appears to mean "without specifically trying to roll or not roll your highlighted stats".

Personally, I'm still confused about why that would be, as the extra effort involved in my "8 bubble" system seems to be less than the effort saved by skipping the highlighting procedure from start-of-session. 

 

19
Apocalypse World / Re: Help me understand the logic behind advancement?
« on: August 18, 2010, 04:21:57 PM »
Vincent,

if that's the case, I'm confused again.  Consider the following system:

"Whenever you make a move, mark improvement.  When you fill your 8th bubble, select an improvement option." 

Could you explain in what way the current system improves on the hypothetical? 

20
Apocalypse World / Re: Help me understand the logic behind advancement?
« on: August 18, 2010, 09:01:01 AM »
Tavis,

It sounds to me like you're beginning with a fixed idea of what your character wants, and then looking at highlighted stats as something that interferes with pursuing it. That makes sense if you assume that your character is, well, 100% yours and shaped only by your input.

AW doesn't work that way--other players actually get to help shape your character.  You see it in the Hx rules, which allow other players to declare things about you, and to a lesser extent in the manipulation move (how many RPGs let you mechanically compel the behavior of other PCs?).  I'd suggest looking at highlighted stats, not as a *distraction* from what your character wants, but as a *clue* to what your character wants. 


21
Apocalypse World / Re: Facebook pages
« on: August 13, 2010, 03:21:00 PM »
And here I thought you were gonna discuss your favorite Brainer's facebook page...

22
Apocalypse World / Re: Maestro D's Gang
« on: August 13, 2010, 03:04:40 PM »
Weirdly, Id argue that *not* having Leadership is Pack Alpha is quite possibly an advantage.  Missing a roll on either of those explicitly causes a relatively serious betrayal, probably worse than the result of flubbing a rune of the mill manipulate roll. 

23
blood & guts / Re: Without act under fire...
« on: August 12, 2010, 05:34:10 PM »
Not sure what you mean--you're making very intelligent extrapolations form very small amounts of information, I don't think I explained that anywhere. 

24
blood & guts / Re: Without act under fire...
« on: August 12, 2010, 03:33:07 PM »
Assert your authority is the basic social move because the PCs are formerly-upperclass criminals in a world where the lower classes have been bioengineered for obediance. 

It's very similar to manipulate in that you can roll to dictate someone's behavior, but only if you have something over them.  So the default use of the move would be "assert my authority (over the conscripts), where my authority arises from genetic compulsion" but you could also use it on a captured noble by doing something like "assert my authority, where my authority is a big fucking gun". 

25
blood & guts / Re: Without act under fire...
« on: August 12, 2010, 03:07:59 PM »
Michael,

so your advice would be to start with playbooks and reason from them to the stats?  That does make a good degree of sense.  The specifics of your advice don't quite match the setting--nobody thinks Sorcerers are "weird" in this world--but of course you couldn't know that. 

Lumpley, the discussion you linked is fascinating, but that group was doing something a little different than what I had in mind.  I wanted to a keep a number of well-defined basic moves, something like:

--when you assert your authority
--when you engage in a contest
--when you consult the Rings
--when you pull from the Pattern
--when you whip up a gadget

etc. 

but when I was diagramming matchups of moves to stats, there was no room for Act under Fire to have a stat to itself.  Therefore it's that one move I wanted to axe.  So instead of the AW flowchart which is something like

--if this is a character move, use it; else
--if it's a basic move, use it; else
--use acting under fire

I want to use this:

--if this is a character move, use it; else
--if this is a basic move, use it; else
--make up an appropriate stat


26
blood & guts / Re: Without act under fire...
« on: August 12, 2010, 01:32:01 AM »
Well, originally, the idea was that the game would primarily focus on teams of specialists doing breaking & entering, kidnapping and hostage retrieval, and investigation.  That very narrow focus was required because the game engines I was used to modeled fine enough levels of detail that separating characters too much was just awkward.  Now I'd like to expand the scope of the game to include battlefield maneuvers and prolonged negotiations as things people might get involved with, and let the players each have some room to explore. 

In the original game engine I was using, I had 5 skills: Martial Arts, Human Resources, Technical, Sorcery, and Spiritualism.  (well actually they had japanese names that were less awkward, but w/ever).  That kind of task-based segregation made sense in the context of team-based operations, because it gave everyone a natural role on the team--having one characters numbers mark him as "technical" nominates him to star when the team needs to bypass security measures, and tack a back seat when a suspect needs to be bluffed. 

My concern about carrying over that numerical division to Apocalypse World's engine is twofold: first, that having to define the nature of the danger before rolling adds an extra operation to the move resolution, and second, that the correspondence is too neat.  Martial Arts was meant to help you get past many technological traps, and sorcery was meant to provide some antipersonnel firepower.  I could work those in through playbook moves, of course but it is a concern.

The alternative is to use more function-agnostic stats like the AW default ones and bring in specializations like technical, kung fu, or medical through the playbooks.  The only problem becomes deciding what stats to base the playbooks off.  It's not obvious to me whether a Sorcerer is more Cool or more Hard, or whether a Diplomat should be Sharper than a Technician. 

27
blood & guts / Without act under fire...
« on: August 11, 2010, 03:39:28 AM »
A couple of play sessions confirms that "do something under fire" is pretty much the fundamental move that makes the game tick.  I'd go so far as to say that you don't, strictly speaking, need any other moves to have a playable game.  All my instincts tell me not to fix what ain't broken, but the fiction for my cyberpunk hack is asking me to tweak it, so here goes:

Act Under Fire is the only thing Cool does by default, and even then it's impressive enough that ways to raise cool are difficult to come by in AW.  Now, in Identity Crisis, every stat already has some moves associated with it, and therefore tacking Act Under Fire onto any of them feels like overloading it.  Hence, I'm wondering what y'all think of replacing

"when you do something under fire, roll +Cool" with

"when you do something under fire, roll

+fire if the fire is technological
+wood if the fire is social
+metal if the fire is physical
+water if the fire is sorcerous
+earth is the fire is spiritual"

I'm worried that it may be too clunky, slowing down the game or provoking argument in "mixed case" situations, but it's the way I'm leaning. 

28
New Basic Move: Act under fire

When you do something under fire, roll+whatever stat is associated with the fire.  Wood for interpersonal threat, metal for physical threat, fire for technical threat, earth for threats from the Rings, and water for threats from the pattern.  Then proceed as in the core book. 

29
Introducing: The Shugenja

Names:

Getter, Walls, Fisher, Superior,

Shinjiro, Hikari, Mikado,

Look:
male, female, cyborg, ambiguous
ornate kimono, monastic robes, traveling leathers,
face TBD
black eyes, darting eyes,
gangly body, potbellied body, wizened body,

Earth 0 Fire +1  Metal -1 Water +2 Wood +1
Earth +2 Fire 0 Metal -1 Water +2 Wood -1
Earth -1 Fire +1 Metal +1  Water +2 Wood 0
Earth +1 Fire 0 Metal 0 Water +2 Wood +0

Shugenja Moves

Undertow: +1 to Water (max +3)

Shadow Deconstruction: When you want to destroy a shaodw-creation, roll+earth.  On a 10+ sure, it's gone.  On a 7-9 it's history but first it gets to make a move.  If you deconstruct an Elder shadow, you're acting under fire. 

Ray of Nonexistence: When you go aggro, you roll +water instead of +metal.

Lightning Feng Shui: when you want to get in or out of somewhere, roll +water.  On a hit, you get in or out clean; on a 7-9 you have to take something with you.  This move often involves flying around or blowing holes in things. 

Open the Dam: when you want to conjure a large quantity of something, roll +water; on a 10+ you get it in a safe and controlled way; on a 7-9 it's loud and messy (this might inflict harm to bystanders depending on what you summoned.)

Divert the Flow: Whenever you succeed at going aggro, issuing a challenge, asserting authority, or acting under fire, you can use forcefields to prevent NPCs from leaving the scene.  PCs who do so act under fire.     

Shugenja Gear (choose 2)

Sutra of Firestorms (3-harm far area loud reload)
Sutra of Vortices (3-harm close/far messy)
Sutra of Stillness (1-harm (ap) close
Sutra of Binding (s-harm close area reload)


30
Apocalypse World / Re: Combat & Combat Types: Help, I don't get it!
« on: August 06, 2010, 03:06:57 AM »
If you want to kill someone then your choices typically are:

If they're fighting back, you typically need to seize their life by force

If they're not yet fighting, you are allowed to "go aggro, and what I want you to do is fucking die" --at which point they either cave and die, or suck up the harm...and probably die. 

Or, use the fiction to catch them asleep or something and you probably don't roll anything. 

As for the Battlebabe, I think almost every Battlebabe will want to start with Ice Cold.  That means you roll +cool to go aggro, so you can assassinate people by suddenly attacking.  The only problem is that one going aggro may not do enough harm to an armored target, as you don't get a "terrible harm" option like with seize. But with a 3-harm weapon and Merciless, you can one-shot even armored NPCs. 

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