Barf Forth Apocalyptica

the swamp provides => AW:Dark Age => Topic started by: trayburn on March 03, 2014, 03:51:20 PM

Title: Rank
Post by: trayburn on March 03, 2014, 03:51:20 PM
I like Rank and how it sets up a variety of items and class based thought, but how is Rank chosen?
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Adam Dray on March 03, 2014, 03:54:39 PM
It's a choice on the playbooks.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: trayburn on March 03, 2014, 04:00:20 PM
I see that, but why choose a lower rank?
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: pseudoidiot on March 03, 2014, 04:04:57 PM
I'd imagine for the same reason you'd choose a higher rank: it's what you find interesting to play or what best suits the character you're making.

Personally, I think I'd have more fun playing a rank 7 Dragon-Herald than 3rd or 4th rank.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: lumpley on March 03, 2014, 04:06:13 PM
Yep.

If you're creating a character, and you want to choose the highest rank available, please do. If you always and only ever want to choose the highest rank available, that's fine, you may.

If you want to choose one of the lower available ranks, please do.

There's no answer to "why choose a lower rank" except "if you want to, please do." There's no buyoff or tradeoff or anything like that.

-Vincent
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: trayburn on March 03, 2014, 04:27:16 PM
I just assumed, wrongly, that because the Ranks were set up with such specifics that they would have mechanic based tie-ins.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: blinks on March 03, 2014, 04:29:50 PM
In a sense, they do have mechanical tie-ins, since the game revolves around the fiction.

A character at 1st rank is going to drive a very different game than a character at 7th rank.  Both interesting, but very different.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: trayburn on March 03, 2014, 04:32:51 PM
I am curious to see a group that all wants to be Rank 1.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: blinks on March 03, 2014, 04:35:39 PM
Agreed, seems like it'd have a ton of PvP.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Antisinecurist on March 03, 2014, 04:47:24 PM
The higher your rank, the more benefits you get (usually).
The higher your rank, the bigger target you are.

That's all, I think.
- Alex
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: jon_bristow on March 03, 2014, 04:48:58 PM
But what are the implications of choosing lower classes? That doesn't seem to be spelled out mechanically for the different classes other than the general implications of the Rank mechanic.

It seems like taking a lower rank signifies that you want to have fewer obligations, but you pay for that with less social power and (more importantly) less control over the shape of the world.  The people who choose the higher rank options will make more choices about how the game world is set up, and thus have more story control.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: sweetpavement on March 03, 2014, 04:50:40 PM
I think a group of all Rank 1s would look a lot like the the interplay between Danaerys, the two Baratheons, and whats-his-face out in the Kraki islands... It would be a lot of PvP, but not as much *direct* PvP as one would expect, I think. I could see it being a really interesting game, but as a narrative it would be a much more epic story than a group of 3s or 7s.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Praion on March 03, 2014, 06:28:23 PM
I see that, but why choose a lower rank?

Maybe you don't want to deal with so many aspects of holding management?
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: trayburn on March 03, 2014, 06:44:45 PM
I see that, but why choose a lower rank?

Maybe you don't want to deal with so many aspects of holding management?

Does this need to be an MC move, exploit one's rank?
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: wightbred on March 04, 2014, 01:07:02 AM
I like this. You can have whatever rank and holdings you want... but can you hold onto it?
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Lirsumis on March 04, 2014, 04:49:55 PM
Rank is just another way for the players to show the MC what kind of game they want. In AW, picking a playbook with a holding, following or other group attached to it shows that the players are interested in being linked to a central location or thing that stories spill out of, rather than actively engaged in seeking out adventure.

It seems that rank, with it's various advantages and drawbacks, is a powerful narrative tool that allows the players and the MC to set the political tone as well as the scale of the stories told. Muddy skirmishes between small bands of hungry men, or devious back room diplomacy and ranks of armored knights charging at each other across the fields of battle. Though power naturally accrues through rank, it doesn't grant any more or less personal agency. From the Outlaw Heir playbook, you could quite easily be a dispossessed nobleman or landowner who's family lands were stolen who now haunts the forests, robbing from the rich and giving to the poor, or you could be the scion of kings, a prince out to reclaim his thrown with the support of his uncle, a neighboring king with a huge standing army.

Two totally different levels of power, equally intriguing, right out of the box.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Antisinecurist on March 04, 2014, 04:59:32 PM
Also, the obvious one, the higher your rank, the harder you'll be hit when your fortunes go south!

- A
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: kobutsu on March 04, 2014, 06:00:52 PM
So, something interesting to me, that you don't get from looking at an individual playbook: not every rank is equally available. With the five we have, only the Dragon-Herald can start at rank 7. That is really cool to me, and worth doing some information-design to convey, perhaps. Suddenly, that's a reason to be the Dragon-Herald (as though I needed more!): to be the dirty peasant who the mighty lords cannot afford to ignore.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Nice_Mr_Caput on March 06, 2014, 09:36:42 AM
I really like that players get to choose their rank freely and I don't think the lower ranks need equal benefits, but it would still be really interesting to see cases where low rank gives you stuff. Criminal contacts and ill-gotten gains, perhaps? Bounties on your head? Something brought with you from foreign lands?

So far it mostly just gives you less stuff, which is fine but might represent a missed opportunity.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: Joao on March 06, 2014, 09:56:51 AM

I think the choice its already an opportunity. At least (but not the least) from a fiction POV.

Maybe it's an opportunity to have less things to manage, or to have a less stake on the world, maybe to become part of someone else's retinue (someone elese  with more responsabilities and political ambitions) or just to play different kinds of stories. Or the same kind from a different perspective.

With great rank comes great responsability and sometimes you will want to play the peasant hero, or the guy from below, the one not favoured by society.

Why would you that? That's what I'm eager to find out while playing!
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: AlfieK on March 06, 2014, 11:41:13 AM
It would be a poor fiction if it only concerned itself with the rich and powerful. I really like the option to play characters at differing levels of the social heirarchy - and it could surely lead to some very interesting interactions between player-characters.

I'm not convinced that characters of a lower social rank need compensation for starting with less wealth and power, either - there are (as some have pointed out) a few advantages in the form of less responsibility and management, but I think it would also be an injustice to present poverty as fun, or at least as having mitigating factors. It's not as if it represents a lack of agency (and in this regard I'm glad that Dark Age isn't a medieval peasant simulator), but it definitely conveys the different qualities of life and choices available to people at different tiers of the class structure.
Title: Re: Rank
Post by: fealoro on March 06, 2014, 11:45:26 AM
The less you have the less can go wrong with Fortunes...