Barf Forth Apocalyptica
powered by the apocalypse => Dungeon World => Topic started by: Antisinecurist on July 12, 2012, 10:23:52 AM
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Just a thing I threw together, probably not very good! Feedback, please. :)
- Alex
They say you'll be no use in a dungeon. You're sure you're not afraid to get your hands dirty. Prove it, noble.
Look
Stats
4+constitution HP
d6 damage
Gear
You begin play with 50 gold, any mundane gear you desire, and two or three hirelings that the GM will detail for you.
Bonds
Alignment
Races
Dwarf: The kings and craft-princes of the dwarves were prized for their hardiness. You have +2 hit points.
Elven: You've learned to be wary of hidden dangers and stalking assassins. When you'd suffer damage from a source you were unaware of, reduce that damage by 2.
Human: You were born for the lure of civilization. Whenever you make a steading move, take +1.
Moves
Connections: When you need access to something or someone, spread the word and roll+cha. On a 10+, someone has what you need for a reasonable price. On a 7-9, choose one.
- it's exorbitantly expensive, even for you
- it's dangerous to obtain
- it'll cost you in non-monetary ways, like favors or tasks
Esoteric Training: You grew up in a lavish and luxurious manner; no cost was spared in your pleasure or education. Pick two subjects from the following; when they apply to a roll you make, take +1.
- dueling
- horsemanship
- ancient history
- courtship and seduction
- warfare and strategy
- geography and politics
- languages and cultures
- sailing
Hired Assistant: You've got a hired assistant of above-average skill and capability. Choose a class not occupied by another one of the players; your assistant has one move from that class (for the purposes of this move, preparing and casting spells counts as a single move) that they will use on your behalf and appropriate gear. Choose a name and look from that class. The assistant has hit points and damage as per that class, but uses your stats for rolls. Your hired assistant desires one of the following and will serve you as long as you provide it.
- riches
- justice
- thrills
- love
- reknown
Person of Lordly Caliber: When you aid or interfere with another PC, increase the bonus or penalty by 1. When you order hirelings, take +1.
Adv Moves
Bargain: When you go to buy something, reduce the price in coins by your charisma (if this drops the price to 0 coins, they give it to you in good will or a token of admiration or something).
Goad: When you insult and threaten an intelligent creature, roll+cha. On a hit, they're angry at you and all their focus is on you. On a 10+, take +1-ongoing against them as long as they're mad.
Gold Magnet: Whenever you enter a steading and spend a little time there, roll+cha. On a 10+, gain 1d6*10 coin. On a 7-9, gain 1d6*5 coin. Either way, the GM'll probably ask how you got it. On a miss, you find you've been robbed!
Gossip: When you go out in a steading and spread rumors about a person, place, or thing, roll+cha. On a hit, some people in the steading believe you, but not everyone. On a 7-9, choose one. On a 10+, choose two.
- most everyone in the steading believes you
- it travels to nearby steadings as fast as is reasonable
- nobody can trace the rumors to you
Hardened: You've been hardened by your nights on the road and days deep underground. Gain +2 hit points.
Life of the Party: When you carouse, on a 12+ choose as many options as you'd like. Everyone had a blast and people will talk about this for years to come; you're a minor celebrity in this steading now.
Lucky: When you make camp or visit a steading, hold 3 luck. Whenever you roll a miss, spend 1 luck and re-roll. On a hit, explain how you succeed by sheer fortune and good luck. When you spend your last luck, well, your luck has run out... take -1-forward until you gain more.
Student: You've learned well from your companions. Whoever you have the most bonds with, choose and learn one of their class moves.
Talented Assistant: Your assistant has all the starting moves of his class.
Word of Command: When you give an NPC or collected group of NPCs an order, roll+cha. On a 10+, select two and the GM will pick one. On a 7-9, the GM picks one.
- they angrily attack
- they back of slowly
- they grovel and beg
- they do it
- they offer you something else they think you want
Worldly: You pick up new skills easily; choose a playbook not currently in use by another player and gain a move from it.
(6-10)
Jack of All Trades (Requires: Worldly): You pick up new skills easily; choose a playbook not currently in use by another player and gain a move from it.
Keen Learner (Requires: Student): You've learned well from your companions. Whoever you have the most bonds with, choose and learn one of their class moves.
Master Assistant (Requires: Talented Assistant): Your assistant is considered to be one level lower than you and gains advancements as appropriate.
Supremely Lucky (Requires: Lucky): You may also spend your luck to:
- avoid all damage from a single attack
- find or have on hand a single mundane item you need
- run into someone helpful to you right now
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For gear, consider: Ask each other person at the table to detail one hireling that will begin play in your employ.
Hardened seems out of place. Consider: Well Fed - Years of the fine cooking and never having missed a meal have done wonders for your health, take +2 HP.
Student and Worldly and Jack of All Trades and Keen Learner make the noble quite the multi-class.
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For gear, consider: Ask each other person at the table to detail one hireling that will begin play in your employ.
Hardened seems out of place. Consider: Well Fed - Years of the fine cooking and never having missed a meal have done wonders for your health, take +2 HP.
Student and Worldly and Jack of All Trades and Keen Learner make the noble quite the multi-class.
I like your idea about having the other players detail hirelings! That's great.
For hardened, it's meant to imply a character progression, like: You started out weak and soft, but your adventuring has changed you and made you hard.
Similiarly, I see the noble as entering the world of adventuring sort of naively, but very open and curious, so he or she picks up more knowledge as they go along. This is the logic behind things like Student &etc.
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I really love this!
Master Assistant seems like a rather steep advance. If you take that as your level 10 move your assistant suddenly gains 8 moves/advances?
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What if your assistant could spend XP to level up like you (but never to your level or higher)? If the noble gets to mark XP for failures on the assistant's dice then he'll already be getting some more XP than everyone else, maybe the assistant is kind of an XP sink?
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Yeah, it's clunky and inelegant.
Having the assistant gain-and-spend XP might work, although it leads to a few potentially odd cases. Still, might be the best bet. One thing is, when you take the advance, instead of the assistant just getting the new moves, they gain one.
Then, whenever you spend time in a steading (similiar to the preperation move), they study and learn another move, until they have the proper compliment.
Edit: Unless you mean making assistant XP gain part of the base move, and not an advancement! That should work okay.
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Esoteric Training: amusing pastimes or games of skill and chance or something
Above the Law: when you plunge a blade into another person, do +2 damage?
I actually really like the idea that the assistant could level higher than the PC. That seems like it captures the noble essence better. Maybe you end up sort of a hive character.
And I'd like Gold Magnet better if the 7-9 result got you the same cash as the hard hit, but with complications.
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Above the Law: when you plunge a blade into another person, do +2 damage?
Above the Law
When you return to a civilized place in which you've caused trouble before, roll+Cha. On a hit, all the right people feel that your ill deeds are of little consequence. On a 7–9, that, and, the GM chooses a complication:
• ...but only if you seek a pardon personally
• ...but only if you make a show of good faith
• ...but only if you have something to offer
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Mease, I really like that move! And Christopher, yeah, that'd probably be a better result on a 7-9.
I'll upload a more complete version reflecting the changes when I can, probably over the weekend.
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Yeah, it's clunky and inelegant.
Having the assistant gain-and-spend XP might work, although it leads to a few potentially odd cases. Still, might be the best bet. One thing is, when you take the advance, instead of the assistant just getting the new moves, they gain one.
Another option that might be a bit "faster" than tracking individual XP would be this:
Master Assistant (Requires Talented Assistant)
Your assistant has greatly increased their skills in their chosen profession. Choose 4 Advanced Moves from the Level 2-5 list for the assistant's class OR two Advanced Moves from the Level 2-5 list and one Advanced Move from the Level 6-10 list.
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This is very interesting. Much more of a "Pet Class" than even the Ranger. I like it!
I like your explanation for Hardened. Most class Moves are about the character becoming more skilled in his Class. A Rogue with Advanced Rogue moves is more Rogue-y than one with only Basic Rogue Moves.
But with Hardened, you have a Noble not becoming better at Nobbing. Instead, the Noble is growing as a PERSON and an ADVENTURER, not just as a Noble. I like it.
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You should word the hirelings like they do in Apocalypse world:
You have three hirelings (perhaps named Alfred, Ralf The Giant and Mister Hornbury).
I find the racial moves a little bland, Maybe have 1 get a bonus (I like the elves, it's flavourful and pretty awesome) and the other ones getting something that expands what they can do (additional questions to moves, etc.)
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I liked your class, but I think it step in some bard's toes (with great ideas)...
So, don't you mind if I take some of it to bard?
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I liked your class, but I think it step in some bard's toes (with great ideas)...
So, don't you mind if I take some of it to bard?
You can of course borrow any ideas you'd like. :)
Of course, perhaps some of this can be refactored out to a Compendium Class that either nobles or bards could take. Hm...
Oh, and to MrPrim's last comment: I really love how there's implicit character development inherent in many *world character advancement systems (esp. apoc world) but I see it a little lacking in DW (although there are some good cases!).
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Maybe an advanced move where you move closer to the throne? Something like the Get In Line move from the 2nd Compendium?
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I've updated this with some changes based on various feedback; I've also added look, bonds, and alignment. Hopefully the formatting on this doesn't mess up too bad!
Thanks, everyone!
- AD
They say you'll be no use in a dungeon. You're sure you're not afraid to get your hands dirty. Prove it, noble.
Look
cunning eyes, innocent eyes, grim eyes, hopeful eyes
fat body, diseased body, handsome body, athletic body
fine clothes, unless you're slumming or in disguise (in which case, pauper's clothes)
a staff of office, heirloom sword, illuminated book of legends, or pet bird or dog
Stats
4+constitution HP
d6 damage
Gear
You begin play with 50 gold, any mundane gear you desire.
Ask each other player in turn to define a hireling that works for you (cost, skill, and name).
Bonds
____ served under my father, and I was cruel to them
____ served under my father, and I was kind to them
____ is an uncultured savage, but I will teach them of the finer things
____ amazes me with their skill and talent; I hope to learn from them
Alignment
Evil: Murder someone to advance your ambition
Good: Use your connections and influence to help others
Lawful: Take action to uphold the current political system
Chaotic: Subvert the system to your own ends
Races
Dwarf: You were trained in the ways of the merchant-princes of the deep mountain holds. Add the following to your esoteric training: stonework, smithing, and fine craftsmanship
Elven: You've learned to be wary of hidden dangers and stalking assassins. When you'd suffer damage from a source you were unaware of, reduce that damage by 2.
Human: You've learned to twist the dagger after the thrust; whenever you successfully manipulate, blackmail, intimidate, or command someone, take +1-forward against them.
Moves
Connections: When you need access to something or someone, spread the word and roll+cha. On a 10+, someone has what you need for a reasonable price. On a 7-9, choose one.
- it's exorbitantly expensive, even for you
- it's dangerous to obtain
- it'll cost you in non-monetary ways, like favors or tasks
Esoteric Training: You grew up in a lavish and luxurious manner; no cost was spared in your pleasure or education. Pick two subjects from the following; when they apply to a roll you make, take +1.
- dueling
- horsemanship
- ancient history
- courtship and seduction
- warfare and strategy
- games of skill and chance
- geography and politics
- languages and cultures
- sailing
Hired Assistant: You've got a hired assistant of above-average skill and capability. Choose a class not occupied by another one of the players; your assistant has one move from that class (for the purposes of this move, preparing and casting spells counts as a single move) that they will use on your behalf and appropriate gear. They may also use any of the basic moves on your behalf. Choose a name, look, and alignment from that class.
The assistant has hit points and damage as per that class, but uses your stats for rolls. When the assistant fails a roll on your behalf, they mark XP instead of you. In addition, the assistant marks XP at the end of the session based on alignment and question-answering. They level up when they reach the required amount and choose a new move, but they never increase stats and can't go above 5th level.
Your hired assistant desires one of the following and will serve you as long as you provide it.
- riches
- justice
- thrills
- love
- reknown
Person of Lordly Caliber: When you aid or interfere with another PC, increase the bonus or penalty by 1. When you order hirelings, take +1.
Adv Moves
Above the Law: When you return to a civilized place in which you've caused trouble before, roll+cha. On a hit, all the right people feel that your ill deeds are of little consequence. On a 7–9, that, and, the GM chooses a complication:
- but only if you seek a pardon personally
- but only if you make a show of good faith
- but only if you have something to offer
Bargain: When you go to buy something, reduce the price in coins by your charisma (if this drops the price to 0 coins, they give it to you in good will or a token of admiration or something).
Goad: When you insult and threaten an intelligent creature, roll+cha. On a hit, they're angry at you and all their focus is on you. On a 10+, take +1-ongoing against them as long as they're mad.
Gold Magnet: Whenever you enter a steading and spend a little time there, roll+cha. On a hit, gain 1d6*10 coin. On a 7-9, also choose one.
- someone takes an unsavory interest in your wealth
- there are some strings attached
- you'll need to pay it back at some point
- it comes from less than reputable sources
Either way, the GM'll probably ask how you got it. On a miss, you find you've been robbed!
Gossip: When you go out in a steading and spread rumors about a person, place, or thing, roll+cha. On a hit, some people in the steading believe you, but not everyone. On a 7-9, choose one. On a 10+, choose two.
- most everyone in the steading believes you
- it travels to nearby steadings as fast as is reasonable
- nobody can trace the rumors to you
Hardened: You've been hardened by your nights on the road and days deep underground. Gain +2 hit points.
Jocky: When you take this move, ask how many people stand between you and the throne, if it isn't clear already. He'll list a bunch (5, maybe, 10) of obvious suspects - people who are higher in rank, more influential, closer to the current ruler. He'll also list some less obvious folks - people who aren't maybe in line to rule themselves, but who'd block you from moving forward. Whenever you take action that might allow you to surpass the next person in line, roll+cha. On a 10+, you've managed to advance your cause. On a 7-9, the GM chooses one:
- you've moved them out of the way or placated them, but someone else steps in to fill the void
- you've moved them out of the way or placated them, but someone higher up is now suspicious and wary
- you've not surpassed them, yet, but you're close the GM will tell you how you can do it
Life of the Party: When you carouse, on a 12+ choose as many options as you'd like. Everyone had a blast and people will talk about this for years to come; you're a minor celebrity in this steading now.
Lucky: When you make camp or visit a steading, hold 3 luck. Whenever you roll a miss, spend 1 luck and re-roll. On a hit, explain how you succeed by sheer fortune and good luck. When you spend your last luck, well, your luck has run out... take -1-forward until you gain more.
Student: You've learned well from your companions. Whoever you have the most bonds with, choose and learn one of their class moves.
Talented Assistant: Your assistant has all the starting moves of his class.
Word of Command: When you give an NPC or collected group of NPCs an order, roll+cha. On a 10+, select two and the GM will pick one. On a 7-9, the GM picks one.
- they angrily attack
- they back of slowly
- they grovel and beg
- they do it
- they offer you something else they think you want
Worldly: You pick up new skills easily; choose a playbook not currently in use by another player and gain a move from it.
(6-10)
Jack of All Trades (Requires: Worldly): You pick up new skills easily; choose a playbook not currently in use by another player and gain a move from it.
Keen Learner (Requires: Student): You've learned well from your companions. Whoever you have the most bonds with, choose and learn one of their class moves.
Master Assistant (Requires: Talented Assistant): Your assistant can reach up to level 10.
Supremely Lucky (Requires: Lucky): You may also spend your luck to:
- avoid all damage from a single attack
- find or have on hand a single mundane item you need
- run into someone helpful to you right now
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Man, it's very good!
Your class is very evocative =)
Other class I'd love to see is the Warlord (maybe mixing something for the fighter, the paladin and the noble).
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Since this has proved so popular, I've posted two new compendium classes that a noble might take, over in my "Little Things" thread.
http://apocalypse-world.com/forums/index.php?topic=2938.0 (http://apocalypse-world.com/forums/index.php?topic=2938.0)
The Spymaster collects secrets like dragons hoard gold, using them for the power they bring. The Warlord is a keen and able commander of soldiers and allies. Both of them are suitable for a number of classes, but may be fun for nobles. :)
- Alex
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The Chaotic alignment key seems a little... evil?
A chaotic, adventuring noble seems (to me) to be more about experiencing the rush and excitement of life on the edge. I'm not happy with any of these, but something like:
-Take an unnecessary risk just for the thrill of it
-Do or feel something you've never done or felt before
or maybe
-Cause trouble for your allies or servants
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Hm! I'm not convinced it's evil, but I'm curious. I'd like to hear more opinions on the chaotic alignment! :)
- Alex
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I think the word subvert is the weak link in the chaotic alignment. It suggests getting something unintended out of the system, like a tax dodge or voiding military surplus to feed the poor. I think you want a word that implies changing the system, not using it to do something unintended. A lawful person would get in line and uphold the system, right or wrong. A good person or an evil person would subvert it to further their goals. A chaotic person might say that the system is broken or should not exist at all and try to dismantle it. Maybe dismantle would work better?
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Oh, man, that's totally strange to me! I see subversion of the system as a very chaotic thing, but not necessarily evil (maybe good, maybe evil, maybe just chaotic).
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Right but you are subverting the system to do something (good or bad). You're still working within and using the system. For example, corporations subvert "the system" all the time, are they chaotic? [crap, I don't have a good answer to that question] What is left when you cut away good, bad, and lawful? Is there a clearer example of being chaotic? [no good answer for that either]
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Hmm. Interesting. Though, I'd say that "The Noble" is much more appropriate as a Compendium Class. That said, don't listen to me!
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I think the word subvert is the weak link in the chaotic alignment. It suggests getting something unintended out of the system, like a tax dodge or voiding military surplus to feed the poor. I think you want a word that implies changing the system, not using it to do something unintended. A lawful person would get in line and uphold the system, right or wrong. A good person or an evil person would subvert it to further their goals. A chaotic person might say that the system is broken or should not exist at all and try to dismantle it. Maybe dismantle would work better?
Oh, man, that's totally strange to me! I see subversion of the system as a very chaotic thing, but not necessarily evil (maybe good, maybe evil, maybe just chaotic).
We get into the realms of moral philosophy pretty quickly here, but I'd take it a step further than Mease (Marshal?) does. If I'm intentionally subverting a system, it's either for personal gain (or fun) or for (what I perceive as) the greater good. If I'm accidentally subverting a system then, or just don't care if do... well, that's not something that should be a core motivator to my character.
I'd try to tie the aligments to speicific observable things, but in a way that demonstrates the Noble's motivation to go adventuring. Show, don't tell. Like, maybe these?
-Evil: Your status or influence lets you get away with something sordid
-Good: You sacrifice your comfort or safety to the benefit of your lessers
-Lawful: You invoke your authority to uphold the law
-Chaotic: You experience a thrill you'd never have gotten in courtly life
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Hmm. Interesting. Though, I'd say that "The Noble" is much more appropriate as a Compendium Class. That said, don't listen to me!
Making it a Compendium Class would imply that you start as an adventurer and become a Noble. What's cool about this class (to me) is the transition from soft Noble to hardened adventurer.
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What about:
Lawful: When you use authority or appeal to tradition to get your way
Chaotic: When you buck authority or defy tradition to get your way
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Making it a Compendium Class would imply that you start as an adventurer and become a Noble. What's cool about this class (to me) is the transition from soft Noble to hardened adventurer.
It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to imagine a compendium class, or set of classes, that apply at first level. The Peasant, The Craftsman, the Noble. All pre-classes you could apply as part of a campaign setup.
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Yeah, remember that Adam and Sage are working with folks who backed at the compendium level to create some cool classes....
The noble or something like it may just be one of them!
That said, I think Alex's work on the Noble is inspired, well done chap! I particularly like the advanced social moves :)
On the chaotic front? Perhaps have two 'tag' word options (or more) under chaotic - that implies the fickle, self-serving nature of their demeanor and the ability to choose how the character percieves their own actions.
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Adam, Jeremy's spot-on on why this is a base class! But the idea of 1st level compendiums is kinda interesting, too! :)
I'd also like to see another form of noble that represents moving into the title / gaining land as opposed to being born in - that'd definitely be an awesome compendium class.
I just had a discussion with a friend about how it's hard to make classes in DW as many things just work better as CCs... :)
Finally, a few of the alignment ideas here have got me thinking. Thanks, guys!
- Alex
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I really like how evocative this class is! However, I found that some of the moves were a bit boring, especially among the advances, and I had a player interested in playing as The Noble. So I ended up doing a pretty major rewrite of the class, and figured I should share it.
Click here to download the playbook for The Noble! (http://www.mediafire.com/view/?cfx8gom7db4wv6d)
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I really like how evocative this class is! However, I found that some of the moves were a bit boring, especially among the advances, and I had a player interested in playing as The Noble. So I ended up doing a pretty major rewrite of the class, and figured I should share it.
Click here to download the playbook for The Noble! (http://www.mediafire.com/view/?cfx8gom7db4wv6d)
Hey cool... I notice you used my take on the original take on the rules. I like the new moves, although I kind of miss having Game of Thrones move around, just for the name :p
Also, for whatever reason, the nice DW-esque font hasn't Imbedded properly for the larger titles. Was it like that on the version I made?
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No, I don't have the DW font. I used my own template to make the sheet, not the one you made. I ended up removing the Game of Thrones move because it's kind of terrible and pointless - if you want to improve your station in life as a Noble, that's something you can just do during play. It doesn't need a move, just go topple over a king somewhere.
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No, I don't have the DW font. I used my own template to make the sheet, not the one you made. I ended up removing the Game of Thrones move because it's kind of terrible and pointless - if you want to improve your station in life as a Noble, that's something you can just do during play. It doesn't need a move, just go topple over a king somewhere.
Yeah, I agree about the Jockey/Game of Thrones move. I just missed the name. I love the Anything You Can Do... move!
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Great class, I really like it!
A few comments:
I would rename Esoteric Training as Elite Education, because esoteric makes it sound like it's really specialized and rare, but really these are topics that are not.
I prefer Hired Assistant to be named Loyal Retainer, but the Desire mechanic is really great.
For the Connections move, why not use a negative approach, similar to the Bend Bars / Lift Gates move of the fighter.
When you put out the word that you need access to something or someone, roll +CHA. On a 10+, choose three. On a 7-9, choose two.
• It doesn't cost a lot of money
• It doesn't take too long before you get results
• You don't need to go out of your way to get it
• You won't owe someone a favor for this
I will continue to review this class.