Barf Forth Apocalyptica

barf forth apocalyptica => Apocalypse World => Topic started by: Khimus on March 21, 2011, 01:59:57 PM

Title: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Khimus on March 21, 2011, 01:59:57 PM
This is a sort of savvy & manipulator, behind-the-curtains kind of character I wanted to make. It does many of the things the Skinner already does, but in a different way.

The Viper´s tongue
In these troubled times, being the alpha boy´s quite a job: too many responsibilities, plus you´ll be the one blamed if sth goes wrong. No protection from bullets or crazy people, sadly.
But the viper´s tongue doesn´t take the glory path. He´ll rather act behind the curtains, have others mess their hands while he stands as clean as a princess. Good for him.

When you create your character, define your affiliation group (a gang, cult, working for sb, serving a hardholder, etc.).
You get Behind the curtains:
At the beginning of the session, or when some downplay time has elapsed, roll+SHARP. On a 10+, hold 3. On a 7-9, hold 1 plus and an obligation, plus another one with a tweak, if you wish.
Spend your hold during the session or prior to it to:
-Know a secret about someone inside the group. (tweak: someone knows you´re watching people)
-Have someone do something for you, and no one will discover you told him (tweak: someone will discover that indeed).
-Influence the group as a whole to take a new direction or do something (tweak: you´ll be blamed if something goes wrong)
-Gain a new, stronger position within the group. (tweak: you make sb fall, and he´ll have his vengeance)
-Get 1-barter (tweak: in exchange for another obligation).

An obligation means the group demands something from you, a service, whatever it is.
On a miss, you get an obligation, and you may choose something from the list (except gaining a stronger position) with a tweak.

Special moves: choose 2
From the back: When you do it from behind or unexpectedly, roll+SHARP instead of HARD to go aggro.
Savvy boy: roll+SHARP instead of HOT when you manipulate someone. If he´s a PC, roll +Hx.
Good sammaritan: when you help somebody without asking for retribution, you get hold 1 over him. While you have hold, they can´t act against you, or get -1 to do it (if PCs).
They may spend 1 of your hold over them if they:
-Give you something you want
-Do something for you (never tell anybody you sent them to do it)
-Act as your eyes and ears
-Become a supporter/ally.
Dirty secrets: when you reach the psychic maelstrom looking for info, roll+WEIRD. Say a name, and on a hit, ask a question from the list:
-What does he contain under the surface?
-Is he involved in a forbidden relationship?
-What sin or mistake haunts her mind?
-Has she got something that doesn´t belong to her?
On a 7-9, you gotta have an input first to get the data. The MC wil ask you one question, and if you answer it you get the secret. The MC will tell you also who knows your secret now.
On a miss, you receive a secret from someone else (MC´s call), plus answer one question from the list. Someone knows your answer, but you don´t know who she is.
If you get a PC´s secret, you get +1Hx with them on your sheet.
I´m nothing!: When trouble arises and you have something to do about it, or are in the middle of it, roll+SHARP. On a 10+, hold 2. On a 7-9, hold 1. Spend your hold to:
-Not to be blamed or deemed responsible for the trouble, offense, etc. If already known responsible, they show mercy instead.
-Make them fail their vigilance upon you for a moment.
-Keep your reputation untouched and clean.
Lord of secrets: When you show somebody you know a secret about him, you hold 2 over him, as in GOOD SAMMARITAN, but you lose it if you uncover the truth.
Veiled message: when you want to deliver a secret message to somebody, or uncover an ugly truth, roll+SHARP and state who will understand the message (and when will he understand it) and who won´t. On a hit, you deliver it. On a 7-9, though, choose 2 complications from the list, the MC will pick one from those and make it true:
-Somebody you didn´t expect understands it too, or intercepts it (if a letter).
-Somebody you didn´t expect understands it all the way wrong, or reacts badly.
-Somebody´s suspecting, and will act accordingly in the future.
-The target of the message understands it sooner or later than what you expected, or gets it incompletely, a little changed, etc.

SPECIAL MOVE: if you and another character have sex, you either get 1 hold over him, as in GOOD SAMMARITAN, or you get to ask a question from the DIRTY SECRETS list, your call.

I might need to drop one of the moves in order to have a shorter list of moves. What do you think?
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Margolotte on March 21, 2011, 04:11:42 PM
I would drop Lord of Secrets. The rest are decent, and I especially like I'm Nothing!
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Khimus on April 28, 2011, 03:16:15 PM
The Viper´s tongue
In these troubled times, being the alpha boy´s quite a job: too many responsibilities, plus you´ll be the one blamed if sth goes wrong. No protection from bullets and crazy people, sadly.
But you don´t take the glory path. You´ll rather act behind the curtains, have others mess their hands while you stand as clean as a princess. Good for you.
NAME
Viper, birdie, snake, flea, worm, rata
Tiny, goodboy, grammy, pal, little p., candy, sugar
LOOK
Man, woman, ambiguous or transgressing
scrounge wear, formal wear, luxe wear, fetish wear
sweet face, thin face, grotesque/striking face, pale face, worn face
calculating eyes, indifferent eyes, sharp eyes, cold eyes, big, creepy eyes
crippled body, fat body, small, dwarven body, rangy body, hunched body, childish body, gorgeous body
STATS
Cool+1, hard0, hot+1, sharp+2, weird-1
Cool+1, hard-1, hot0, sharp+2, weird0
Cool+2, hard-2, hot0, sharp+2, weird0
cool+1, hard-1, hot-1, sharp+2, weird+1
VIPER´S TONGUE´S MOVES
Choose 3
Behind the curtains: (you must have an affiliation group to apply to: gang, cult, family, friends, crew, etc.)
At the beginning of the session, or when some downplay time has elapsed, roll+SHARP. On a 10+, hold 3. On a 7-9, hold 2 with their tweaks.
Spend your hold during the session or prior to it to:
-Know a secret about someone inside the group. (tweak: someone knows you´re watching people)
-Have someone do something for you, and no one will discover you told him (tweak: someone will discover that indeed).
-Influence the group as a whole to take a new direction or do something (tweak: you´ll be blamed if something goes wrong)
-Gain a new, stronger position within the group. (tweak: you make sb fall, and he´ll have his vengeance)
-Get 1-barter (tweak: in exchange for an obligation).
An obligation means the group demands something from you, a service, whatever it is.
On a miss, you get an obligation, and you may choose something from the list (except gaining a stronger position) with a tweak.
From the back: When you do it from behind or unexpectedly, roll+SHARP instead of HARD to go aggro.
Savvy boy: roll+SHARP instead of HOT when you manipulate someone. If he´s a PC, roll +Hx.
Good sammaritan: when you help somebody without asking for retribution, you get hold 1 over him. While you have hold, they can´t act against you; if PCs, it´s acting under fire to go against you.
They may spend 1 of your hold over them if they:
-Give you something you want
-Do something for you (and keep the secret)
-Act as your eyes and ears
-Become a supporter/ally
If you help a PC, you also get +1Hx with her.
Dirty secrets: when you reach the psychic maelstrom looking for info, roll+WEIRD. Say a name, and on a hit, ask a question from the list:
-What does he contain under the surface?
-Is he involved in a forbidden relationship?
-What sin or mistake haunts her mind?
-Has she got something that doesn´t belong to her?
On a 7-9, you gotta have an input first to get the data. The MC wil ask you one question, and if you answer it you get the secret. The MC will tell you also who knows your secret now.
On a miss, you receive a secret from someone else (MC´s call), plus answer one question from the list. Someone knows your answer, but you don´t know who she is.
If you get a PC´s secret, you get +1Hx with them on your sheet.
I´m nothing!: When trouble arises and you have something to do about it, or are in the middle of it, roll+SHARP. On a 10+, hold 2. On a 7-9, hold 1. Spend your hold:
-Not to be blamed or deemed responsible for the trouble, offense, etc. If already known responsible, they show mercy instead.
-to make them fail their vigilance upon you for a moment, or make them underestimate you.
-Keep your reputation untouched and clean.

GEAR
You get:
1 weapon easy to conceal:
-A dagger (2-harm hand)
-Sleeve pistol (2-harm close reload loud)
-Syringe (1-harm intimate)

Plus choose 1:
-drugs (applied, valuable, psi-harm, must be ingested)
-poison (3-harm, applied with the syringe or in food/drink)
-sedatives (s-harm, aplied with the syringe or in food/drink)
-Oddments worth 1-barter

HX
Everyone introduces their characters by name, look and outlook.
Take your turn.
List the other characters´ names.
Go around again for Hx. On your turn, choose 1 or both:
-Choose somebody you pretend to really like. Tell that player Hx-2.
-Choose somebody to whom you´ve revealed your true nature. Tell that player Hx+1
Tell everyone else Hx-1. You keep your stuff secret.

On the others´ turns, choose 1, 2, or all 3:
-Choose somebody you know a secret about. Whatever number that player tells you, ignore it, and write Hx+3 with him instead.
-Choose somebody who helped you honestly once. Whatever number that player tells you, give it -1 and write it down in your sheet.
-Choose somebody you´ve fooled once. Whatever number that player tells you, add +1 to it and write it down in your sheet.

IMPROVEMENT:

-Get +1Cool (+2 max)
-Get +1hard (+2 max)
-Get +1hot (+2 max)
-Get +1weird (+2 max)
-Get another Viper´s tongue move
-Get another Viper´s tongue move
-Get a gang plus pack alpha
-Get a holding plus wealth
-Get a move from another playbook
-Get a move from another playbook

VIPER´S TONGUE SPECIAL
When you and another character have sex, roll+HARD.
On a 10+, you don´t reveal yourself, but he reveals something to you (as in dirty secrets).
On a 7-9, either no one knows anything new, or both reveal a secret to the other (your call).
On a miss, you reveal him a secret.

THE SECRETS
You may learn secrets from your own moves, from reading somebody, following him in secret, whatever makes sense. It´s up to you and the MC whether any piece of information about sb is actually a secret: generally, it should be something harmful if revealed.
-You may obviously use a secret as leverage over an NPC. You may trade a secret for 1-barter.
-When you suddenly reveal a secret in public, you cause psi-harm to sb involved or affected (if PC, roll +2). If he´s an NPC, choose only the "her sanity shatters" effect if it really makes sense.
When a secret goes public, it obviously stops being a secret.


I think it´s finished. How could I edit it to make it look like a playbook?
Would you change anything from it? Maybe dropping a move or two to make it simpler? What do you think about secret revelations causing psi-harm?
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Chroma on April 28, 2011, 04:19:13 PM
Interesting playbook concept!

Good sammaritan: when you help somebody without asking for retribution,
I think you mean "restitution" here... but asking for retribution for being helpful is very Apocalypse World... *laugh*

One thing I hate: the name.  Doesn't seem to fit at all, doesn't roll off the tongue (pardon me), and I can't see someone introducing themselves as, "Hi, I'm the local Viper's Tongue..."

Perhaps one of the following: The Architect, The Broker, The Cipher, or The Diplomat
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: henrythewhite on April 28, 2011, 05:34:54 PM
Perhaps one of the following: The Architect, The Broker, The Cipher, or The Diplomat

Or maybe L'Éminence grise?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89minence_grise (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89minence_grise)
The painting there is pretty cool too.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Arvid on April 29, 2011, 06:06:51 AM
Those are some sweet moves. Nice.

I also like the fact that you made a Sharp playbook, it seems that Hard and Weird are so much easier to come by.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Evan Torner on April 29, 2011, 10:24:36 AM
Quote
One thing I hate: the name.  Doesn't seem to fit at all, doesn't roll off the tongue (pardon me), and I can't see someone introducing themselves as, "Hi, I'm the local Viper's Tongue..."

Perhaps one of the following: The Architect, The Broker, The Cipher, or The Diplomat

I agree that the name's needing an upgrade, but Chroma's suggestions sound kinda benign.

How about some wonkier suggestions: The Whisperer, The Judas, The Two-Face, The Wordsmith, The Oz Wizard, The Weasel
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Chroma on April 29, 2011, 10:29:30 AM
I agree that the name's needing an upgrade, but Chroma's suggestions sound kinda benign.

Sounding benign is the name of the game!  *laugh*  

It's putting a friendly and trustworthy face forward... then backstab!
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Khimus on April 29, 2011, 05:22:34 PM
One thing I hate: the name.  Doesn't seem to fit at all, doesn't roll off the tongue (pardon me), and I can't see someone introducing themselves as, "Hi, I'm the local Viper's Tongue..."
I agree, the name kinda sucks, but in my defense I have to say that, in spanish, "Lengua viperina/bífida" sounds a lot better.
I guess that the Judas, the whisperer, the weasel, the grey eminence, maybe the rogue would work too. I´m still hesitating towards picking a name.

Anyone knows how could I edit the playbook and make it look like the other ones?
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: reaction on April 29, 2011, 05:38:58 PM
If you get a picture for it, I can put together a playbook for you.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Steve Hickey on April 29, 2011, 10:14:57 PM
Just on the name thing, again: playing off the L'eminence grise idea, you could also have 'The Grey', 'The Grease', and 'The Greyhair' (or 'The Greyhead').
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: dragonraven on April 30, 2011, 12:19:06 AM
I personally like just "The Viper." 

"Hi, I'm the Viper."

Seems appropiate. 
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Simon on April 30, 2011, 02:19:53 AM
I decided to pop in and comment that I, too, have been working on a sharp-based playbook that is similar on a lot of levels to this one! Mine is more based around the Man With No Name/Sanjuro figure from those classic films, but there's a lot more similarity between the moves you've made and the moves I've been creating than I am entirely comfortable with!

It looks good, though! I would not mind playtesting one if I can ever get a game going again.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Chroma on April 30, 2011, 07:27:18 AM
"Hi, I'm the Viper."

I guess it depends on your age...

"The Viper is coming..."

Part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbDPAitWKJI)

Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnEhMJ881SM)

Punchline (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyXrwbg1G7c) - if you want to cut to the chase...
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Arvid on April 30, 2011, 11:15:07 AM
Just on the name thing, again: playing off the L'eminence grise idea, you could also have 'The Grey', 'The Grease', and 'The Greyhair' (or 'The Greyhead').

Oh yeah
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Remmun on May 04, 2011, 06:03:39 AM
i'm having difficulty seeing the "get a gang" and "get a holding' options as ones that make sense for this character. this book seems to be about being the second in command and having a gang or a holding implies leadership which doesn't seem to fit
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Chroma on May 04, 2011, 08:28:47 AM
i'm having difficulty seeing the "get a gang" and "get a holding' options as ones that make sense for this character.

I have to agree with this... I could see getting gigs and a crew as a replacement for at least one of those options.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Arvid on May 04, 2011, 09:18:02 AM
i'm having difficulty seeing the "get a gang" and "get a holding' options as ones that make sense for this character.

I have to agree with this... I could see getting gigs and a crew as a replacement for at least one of those options.

Absolutely.

If s/he comes to an overt position of power, maybe it's time to make the switch to Hardholder.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Khimus on May 04, 2011, 01:38:52 PM
i'm having difficulty seeing the "get a gang" and "get a holding' options as ones that make sense for this character. this book seems to be about being the second in command and having a gang or a holding implies leadership which doesn't seem to fit
Yeah, that´s true. I had the idea of including an explanation of how those "get a gang/holding" could work: you get them, but you´re not their formal leader. There´s sb else "in charge", and you´re the second in command, but you´re the one issuing all orders.

But it´s kind of awkward anyway. It´d be better to put them aside and grab 2 new improvement options. Thoughts?
-Getting gigs could work, but a Viper having a sort of job isn´t exactly part of my concept. Maybe if the group explains it as getting a crew and putting them to work...
-A sharp +1 (+3 max) to replace the other advancement would be nice. It was a move I thought the viper lacked, but recently I saw the Angel and he´s got it as an advancement, not a special move.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Chroma on May 04, 2011, 01:44:05 PM
-Getting gigs could work, but a Viper having a sort of job isn´t exactly part of my concept. Maybe if the group explains it as getting a crew and putting them to work...

Don't look at it as a "job", but as the Viper working behind the scenes to get things done... either directly, or through their crew... bringing home the sweet jingle...

The player will do it to do it and it'll all be cool...

Quote
-A sharp +1 (+3 max) to replace the other advancement would be nice. It was a move I thought the viper lacked, but recently I saw the Angel and he´s got it as an advancement, not a special move.

It's not a move for the Angel so that other PCs can't snag it as a "Move from another playbook"... but it's totally valid as an advancement!
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Arvid on May 04, 2011, 05:09:34 PM
Move suggestion:

Dirty fingerprints all over
Whenever a person, event or thing is introduced, roll +Sharp.
10+, you have your strings in it. Maybe you made it happen for some reason, maybe they owe you, or maybe you know where it is hidden.
7-9, you know something about it. What they need, where it is or who has it's strings in it. Take +Forward when acting on this.
On a miss, someone finds out it is connected to you in an inconvinient way.

About the holding thing: How about you could design your Vipers influence, just like you design a hardholders holding, a hocus' cult or a Maestro D's establishment? This could influence exactly what options are available and what obligations come up when rolling Behind the curtain.
As advancements, you could have your influence become stronger, wider, more obscure or more lucrative.

Something like this, but with mechanical implications also:

Create your Spider's Web/Viper's Nest/Weave of Influence/whatever.

You are the soothsayer of (choose one)
- A band of dirty street urchins
- A gang of violent people
- A hardholder and his lieutenants
- A handful of key people in the area
- A boss and his organisation
- A cult
- Unwashed masses
- Merchants, caravans and/or raiders

They are also (choose two)
- Wealthy
- Numerous, choose another group of affiliates
- Gullible (Scapegoats are available!)
- Spread over great distances
- Knowledgable
- Organised

Also, choose one
- Demanding
- Violent
- Poor
- Confused

For your personal security, choose one:
- They consider you harmless
- They greatly respect you
- Webs upon webs of hidden influence
- They are dependent on you
- They are unknowing of each other
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: henrythewhite on May 04, 2011, 07:17:31 PM
I missed this when I was looking before, but Khimus, were you intending for the stat lines to be as unequal as they are?  It was my understanding that the total for a normal stat line was supposed to be +3, possibly lower or higher depending on the playbook, but that they were supposed to be equal to other stat lines for that playbook.  At the moment your second and fourth lines are both lower than average, coming in at +2, instead of the +3 for the first and third line (with the third line at +3 because the second +2 counts as +3).

Anyways, I really like Arvid's suggestion of Dirty Fingerprints All Over, and I think the suggestion of building your own web is cool too.  Though I wonder: how would that work out in terms of playbook balance?  Having a crowd of people who are (ostensibly) yours is a pretty big bonus.  Maybe you'd have one fewer starting moves?
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Arvid on May 05, 2011, 01:31:18 PM
Considering that The Viper stands outside organizations so to speak, here's another suggestion for how to handle Behind the Curtain / The Web.

---

Inner circle
Name four people you hold influence over (more might be added in play):
Name / Influence through
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________

Why do they listen to you? (Pick one for each)
Loyalty, thankfulness, gullability, simplemindedness, greed, paranoia, ambition, addiction,

Why are they valuable to you? (Pick one for each)
Strength, expertise, secrets, wealth, resources, charisma

You interact predominantly with them through (Pick one)
Threats, promises, exchanges, lies, services

The web
Name six people or things that you influence through your inner circle (more might be added in play):
Name / Influenced through whom?
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________
________________

Both actual play and characters improvements might add/subtract what people you influence and what their resources are.

Behind the curtains
(The Viper always gets this move) When trying to get your circle or web to deliver a thing, a person or an event, roll +Sharp. On a hit, it happens.
10+, pick four. 7-9 pick two:
- Nobody of your people gets hurt or compromised
- They don't require anything in return right now
- It can't be traced to you
- It happens just the way you want it to
- It gets just the amount of attention you want it to
On a miss, the influence you hold over them is reversed or turns against you.

Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Jason Morningstar on May 06, 2011, 02:05:34 PM
I like this a lot. I'd call the role The Grease.

"That guy's the Grease around here."

He's what the squeaky wheel gets, you know? He knows how to lubricate various arrangements. Plus he's basically nothing, just the stink left over after you fry up some sewer trout.
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Orion on May 06, 2011, 04:07:40 PM
I think you could have leadership over a gang, while being the power behind the throne of a hardholder...
Title: Re: Playbook Idea, The Viper´s tongue
Post by: Yragael on May 06, 2011, 07:09:27 PM
I beleive that getting a gang means to go on the front of the stage and changing playbook. I think that what is suggested by Arvid (Inner circle and the Web) is much more appropriate. I would just impose names for the people the Viper has influence upon, just like the Maestro D has imposed names for his regulars, such as:

Inner circle
You hold influence over :
Marsh ______________
Scibber _____________
Holster _____________
Two Faces __________
____________________
____________________
____________________
Decide what influence you hold and write it next to the name. More people can be added in game.