Barf Forth Apocalyptica
barf forth apocalyptica => Apocalypse World => Topic started by: mcdaldno on March 07, 2011, 09:21:31 PM
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So,
Lots of people are making cool custom playbooks.
I have one finished, for example (The Grotesque, currently unreleased).
Lots of people are making cool setting hacks, rules tweaks, and the like. While some of them (Dungeon World, Monsterhearts) are big enough to be their own thing, some are smaller.
Some people have made cool maps, cool custom moves, and cool other stuff.
Would people be interested in a fanzine dedicated to collecting this stuff in print form? I know that some people did that with the custom moves thread over on Story Games, but I'd love to see a more open-ended project.
I'm thinking about starting a little fanzine, tentatively called Luxe Eternal. Sell each issue for enough to recoup printing, shipping and handling. Aim to put out four issues over the course of a year, and then reevaluate after a year.
If I did this, would you be interested in contributing stuff? What stuff? Would you be interested in picking up a copy for $2-3? What about a year's subscription for $10-12?
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Yes, yes, yes, yes and yes! I'd be delighted to contribute game stuff, hack stuff, illustrations, opinion pieces, theory pieces, whatever!
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Hey that's a cool idea. You could definitely use any stuff I've made. World of Conan, for example.
I think $2-$3 is the right price for a single issue.
If I were you, I'd be cautious about yearly subscriptions, as that ties you to a regular output. In my experience, it's super easy to get burned out on projects like this, and they're always way more work than they first appear.
I'd be happy to help out with editing and stuff too, if that's required. Also opinions. I have plenty of those so I can give you as many as you want.
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I'd be very keen to see this and support it. Happy to pay those prices or even more depending on the page count. Would be happy to put stuff I've done in (eg: Goblin World) if anyone is interested. I'd suggest starting quarterly as you don't want a millstone around your neck.
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Should have said "I agree with starting quarterly".
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This is an awesome idea. I won't make promises to contribute because I know how sporadic my free time is, but I'll try and get the playbook I'm working on finished off, (someone else will probably have to help with the imagery. I never progressed beyond MS paint.) and you're welcome to use that plus whatever other stuff I dream up along the way.
But I'm in Britain. I don't expect a paper copy, not really. I'd be more than happy to fork out a dollar or two for a .pdf.
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Into it.
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That's awesome. I'd buy it.
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I'd be into it and I'd be willing to help in any way I can.
Any ideas on scope and size? Will it be laid out in any fancy fashion? Consistency with AW as far as layout, especially playbooks? How many pages? Playbooks, moves and hacks are obvious. Fiction? Reviews? Mediography? GMing and playing tips?
Will there be any sort of review process? ie MCs and players given some sense of how balanced the playbook/moves are to the current game or will they just have to figure it out for themselves?
I honestly don't have any initial opinions yet. I was just curious where your ideas were headed. :)
Thanks in advance,
- Don
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Awesome questions, Don.
Playbooks, Moves and Hacks are in. I'd love to have a column or two (like, a "Deconstructing Moves" column by John Harper, for example). Anecdotal reviews & mediography would be awesome: not cutting-edge journalism, but personal experiences interacting with the stuff.
One key thing to think about is this: with the internet being instant and unlimited, what gains value when it's in physical form? Full setting hacks do, and playbooks do, because ease of reference and having something physical to bring to the gaming table do.
Fiction would be interesting, if any good stuff was submitted. I'd be interested in GMing and playing stuff if it was about shifting paradigms, but not just "Top 10 Wasteland Encounters" type stuff. In other words: If someone were to construct a set of alternate GM Principles and Moves, in order to facilitate a different tone of game, I'd be all over publishing that.
Layout: I want to riff off the tri-fold playbook style, as much as possible.
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Totally interested in this, would be happy to contribute in any way possible.
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I am so very down. I'd pay 2-3 a piece, and I'd for sure subscribe to a year+ if such were an option.
I'd also contribute a few things: playbooks, mini-hacks and rules add-ons, and something I'm calling "frames" (after Hell For Leather), which are small-hack/add-ons for different things in the apocalypse or different types of apocalypses. These'd include some custom moves, some variant moves or additional choices for existing playbooks, and possibly new playbooks or gear.
Another idea I've been considering, after my good friend Jacob gave me an AW-themed Christmas card (such coolness!) was holiday-themed playbooks packaged with one or two card designs. So that's on the table too.
Anyways, I'm gonna keep track of this thread to see how it develops, but I'm open to the idea.
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what gains value when it's in physical form?
Things that are hard to print. Like, if your production values were really high -- glossy color pictures and stuff. Or made-by-hand stuff. Or not made on/of simple paper and have it matter.
Things that aren't available, even artificially, as PDFs. I'd like to see playbooks where the PDFs aren't there to be traded over the internet. I'd especially like them to be photo-copied and traded only to those with whom you play the game.
Things that change over time. I was thinking about the following project: make a few physical books for people who know AW well; each with a bit of intro about the project and then a single character playbook -- the same one in each copy. When you pass them out, the person you give it to is supposed to get a sense of what's already there, add to the game and pass it on. Etc. Then you end up with several custom game-sets (or whatever) that all grew differently from the same seed and neat artifacts too. But except for the neat artifact at the end, I guess that's not a great example of things that benefit from being printed. But maybe something like that.
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Would definitely buy this.
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Absolutely. I don't have anything to contribute right now, but I'd definitely drop a few bucks on seeing everyone else's awesome stuff. Plus, I'm old-fashioned; I like the physical artifacts.
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Great idea!
Maybe you should get together with mease19 from the story games Moves Thread...http://story-games.com/forums/comments.php?DiscussionID=13109&page=1 (http://story-games.com/forums/comments.php?DiscussionID=13109&page=1) . Marshall put together a bunch of people's custom move ideas into a booklet.
I agree with Mr. Mcdaldno. A monthly subscription might be getting in over your head. I would just make a few and see how that goes. Were you thinking of doing this zine style or something fancier?
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Hey Ross,
I've seen screenshots of the Custom Moves booklet, and I am going to get in touch with Marshall about that. I'm not sure how to cross-pollinate these projects, but there's gotta be a way.
When I thought "subscription," I was thinking about charging people up front for 4 quarterly issues, and just committing to do the 4 (so, one year's commitment). I think, though, that it's probably too much to wrassle with: instead, I'm going to deal with it issue by issue.
I was thinking of a home-printed product, that was given the sexiest inDesign treatment that I know how to give. Which is to say: something halfway between a zine and a press-quality product. A clean, lovely booklet.
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HAWT! I'm in!
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Hey Joe,
This seems like a great idea to aggregate all this ethereal mass of ideas floating here in random Internet forums.
Any way I'd be able to squeeze in 500 words on The Unwritten Rules of Apocalypse World?
I could use this forum to elaborate, but it'd add value to some future issue of the fanzine if you edited it.
Best,
-Evan
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Anyone interested in submitting something to Luxe Eternal, write to me at:
mcdaldno (at...) gmail (dot...) com
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If people are wanting to submit playbooks, I'd be glad to format them to match the official trifold-style ones... I've done this with several of the home-brew playbooks people have posted here for use in my game. Here are a couple examples:
The Tribal (by Dragonraven):
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B_XJtVbYj_jjYTAyZWIyMGMtMGIwZi00ZmU1LWIxNGYtYTNmNDFlZTEyOTVl&hl=en&authkey=CNWT2sMJ (https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B_XJtVbYj_jjYTAyZWIyMGMtMGIwZi00ZmU1LWIxNGYtYTNmNDFlZTEyOTVl&hl=en&authkey=CNWT2sMJ)
The Ruin Runner (by Jeff Russell, just renamed)
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B_XJtVbYj_jjNjY0ZGMwMjktZjBhNy00NjU5LWFhYmUtZTQ4ZTIxYzkwNjAy&hl=en&authkey=CKqZ8qYO (https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B_XJtVbYj_jjNjY0ZGMwMjktZjBhNy00NjU5LWFhYmUtZTQ4ZTIxYzkwNjAy&hl=en&authkey=CKqZ8qYO)
I'd be glad to make PDFs like this for any playbooks people have...
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Hey Nick,
I'm planning to layout any playbooks being submitted for Luxe Eternal, already. I've managed to get my hands on the tri-fold layout file, and so everything is set up and ready.
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Sounds good! If anybody's interested in having one of their playbooks formatted for trifold just for personal use, I'd be glad to do it for them.
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I will have something ready by the end of the weekend for peer review :)
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Evan, I want to read 500 words on The Unwritten Rules of Apocalypse World!!
And Joe, I want to do a thing for this.
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Oh, this is a good one.
Name your dream article / column.
What would you really love to see in Luxe Eternal?
I'll start.
"Recipes of the Apocalypse"
A collection of fan submitted Game Snack recipes
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"Recipes of the Apocalypse"
A collection of fan submitted Game Snack recipes
I don't think this is what you meant, but... I'd really like to see a section about dealing with scarcity. Like, practical, how-to advice about living on nothing more than a salvaged car battery, three onions, two beets, canned dog food and a shotgun. A recipe for car-battery-heated onion & ragweed soup.
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Yeah I meant more like Mystery Meatballs, or Two Headed Chicken Pot Pies. But that idea is dope also.
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Joe, what format will this take? I'd kind of like to see it be legal-sized pages in portrait so that tri-folds are already perfect for inclusion but that seems like a pretty weird format. What are you thinking on this?
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Christopher,
I tried to puzzle out a way that it'd make sense to have legal tri-fold stuff. My current thought is to have half-letter in portrait (5.5w x 8.5h), and then include legal trifold (4.65w x 8.5h) playbooks in addition.
So, you open up Luxe Eternal, and you get: Luxe Eternal, the half-letter zine; a series of 1-4 legal tri-fold playbooks.
Thoughts?
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So the tri-folds are folded and tucked in, not bound?
That's works as a delivery system, but it would be kind of cool if they could be bound into the work so that they'd stay a part of each issue and still be copyable -- I'm not really sure how we (the consumers) will want to use the resources.
Also, can you have them folded at the printer or do you have to do that before shipping?
I wonder how many printed copies will sell. I'd been thinking of this as a print-only thing. But with your offering of PDFs, I suppose that'll be the biggest portion.
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Oh, you know what would be hella sexy? Half legal w/playbooks tucked in. It would make printing the thing much easier too.
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Half legal is my vote too; with playbooks tucked in/attached somehow.
EDIT: Playbooks to be Luxe Eternal's centerfolds.
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Oh, this is a good one.
Name your dream article / column.
What would you really love to see in Luxe Eternal?
I'll start.
"Recipes of the Apocalypse"
A collection of fan submitted Game Snack recipes
Well heck yes! All the stuff Joe said about scarcity, plus, Apopalypse Corn!
Also, a list of links and references you wouldn't necessarily think of, like catalogs for heavy equipment and EMT quick sheets and mountain-man re-enactment stuff and hobo art. Maybe with a different theme each time, like "Desert" or "Urban Jungle" or "Water-world".
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A couple of other thoughts from the record exec side of me.
<rant>
-charge more. Like $5-10. Why? People would be willing to pay that much, it will always cost more and take longer to make then you plan and by charging more you could afford to pay the contributors.
-pay the contributers, either cash or with product, (give them X amount of zines to sell / give away.) I know we would all do it for free. But put your punk guilt aside for a moment and think about all the crap you do for money that you hate. If we want to build a world where we earn a living for what we love we're going to have to accept payment at some point.
-Allow contributers to print and sell the zines (if they aren't being paid in product in which case they should be able to buy additional zines to sell at cost). This helps everyone out and increases the distribution and visibility of the zine
-Write out an agreement with the contributors, you don't have to sign it, but it should all be in writing. I would ask for 1 year exclusivity for LE, and the option to reprint in an anthology. Decide what the compensation should be, write that down too.
Handshake agreements suck. Nobody remembers the specifics the same. We change, our principles change, people die and suddenly you are dealing with their family instead of them. (true story involving my friend and elliot smith) So yeah, write it down. (i have some examples of agreements if anyone wants one)
</rant>
xo
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Hey Ross,
Great ideas. $10 is going to be too much to charge for what Luxe Eternal is going to be. $10 is what I am charging for the slimmed-down version of Ribbon Drive, and that's a full-color interior book that comes with a compilation CD featuring 12 awesome songs by 10 awesome artists. Luxe Eternal is something smaller than that, and less professional.
$5 sounds quite reasonable, and that might be the case when the dust settles. Giving contributors the ability to sell their own copies sounds like a rad idea, especially if that's limited to local sales: internet & PDF sales go through moi, and you can sell your own copies of LxE at conventions and to your friends and at little zine symposiums if you like.
Thanks for all the awesome ideas. Consider at least a bunch of them implemented.